Pimpernel Smith

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Why care? Cut one’s own path.
Your watch game is strictly junior league anyway. It’s not like you are playing with the big dogs.
'Tis true, you must cut your own swathe through the jungle, lest you be enslaved by another's path.

This then is my holiday watch, the Seiko Zimbe, just the ticket for hanging around the local Tiki bar in a bold Lacoste pique polo:

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Pimpernel Smith

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The problem with those old Longines is they appear like a canny buy - but when shit breaks the parts cannot be bought.
In some cases, you can get non-original generic parts, but then it's worthless to a collector. But with all vintage watches where watch parts are not a given, you need to be factoring in regular services, much more so than any modern watch. I'm not sure where Longines stands on servicing and repairing vintage watches? I read on one of the forums where someone tried to get a Grand Seiko repaired from the 1960s and they sent it back saying the part was no longer available.
 

Kingstonian

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You could buy a new Swatch Longines for not much more. It would be brand new and parts should still be available for some time.

Most people do not know enough about servicing old watches to be sure repairs can be done and will be done to the old movements and associated costs will be reasonable.
 

prince nez

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In some cases, you can get non-original generic parts, but then it's worthless to a collector. But with all vintage watches where watch parts are not a given, you need to be factoring in regular services, much more so than any modern watch. I'm not sure where Longines stands on servicing and repairing vintage watches? I read on one of the forums where someone tried to get a Grand Seiko repaired from the 1960s and they sent it back saying the part was no longer available.
It’s especially so with those examples you’re looking at, which commonly have quite innovative (ie orphan) technologies in the movements, higher beat = higher wear etc. So not only are parts impossible to find, the likelihood of something failing is a lot higher than something that had a longer series run like an old rolex.

You could buy a new Swatch Longines for not much more. It would be brand new and parts should still be available for some time.
Some of their ‘new vintage’ pieces are, as Rambo would say, handsome.
 

Kingstonian

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Pimpernel Smith

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Oh just the usual: the Rail Road one, the Legend Diver, the Lindbergh-Calculations-to-Make-The-Jump-into-Hyper-Space, 1967 Diver, 1945.....

I'm pretty sure all trains have wheels... they just don't have tyres. :drevil:

This Longines Heritage watch would be very nice - if it wasn't for the date window:

I had the silver dial version, but too small at 35mm, plus the plexi-glass crystal scratches way too easily. Polishes out easy enough, but still a pain. Awhile back you could get both versions in 38mm or 41mm (can't remember the exact szie) which was a better option.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I'm closing in now on the champagne Grand Seiko Quartz, 37mm, impossible to get the larger version here without an extended waiting time, in fact, last time I checked at the Seiko Boutique in Amsterdam there was a lead time on the smaller version. But seek and ye shall find, I've zero in on one at an official Seiko dealer in Rotterdam:

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Pimpernel Smith

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^
What about a Tudor?

There's a Tudor GMT due out, same bezel colour scheme as a 'lex Pepsi GMT.
If I wanted a Rolex homage, I would just get a Steinhart. I think the Black Bay GMT is too much of a Rolex clone. A bit of shame as they've done a good job of escaping the poor man's/bastard offspring of Rolex label these last years. Some cracking ranges: the other Black Bay's, Pelagos, Heritage Chronos, et al.

The Grand Seiko Quartz in champagne dial is the holy grail/exit watch for Quartz movement technology me thinks. The Longines VHP with the perpetual calendar is probably a step ahead in functions and a cheaper price range, but the Grand Seiko just blows it away on understated Japanese design, flawless in execution and aesthetics, even Archie Luxury cannot dismiss this watch:

 

formby

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If I wanted a Rolex homage, I would just get a Steinhart. I think the Black Bay GMT is too much of a Rolex clone. A bit of shame as they've done a good job of escaping the poor man's/bastard offspring of Rolex label these last years. Some cracking ranges: the other Black Bay's, Pelagos, Heritage Chronos, et al.

The Grand Seiko Quartz in champagne dial is the holy grail/exit watch for Quartz movement technology me thinks. The Longines VHP with the perpetual calendar is probably a step ahead in functions and a cheaper price range, but the Grand Seiko just blows it away on understated Japanese design, flawless in execution and aesthetics, even Archie Luxury cannot dismiss this watch:
I wouldn't call it an homage as its the same company, its probably a reaction to the crap that companies like Steinhart produce.

I like Grand Seiko, especially their snowflake, but the potential servicing/repair rigmarole puts me off.

I would take anything Archie Luxury says with a pinch of salt, he has to fill out his 10 mins somehow.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I wouldn't call it an homage as its the same company, its probably a reaction to the crap that companies like Steinhart produce.

I like Grand Seiko, especially their snowflake, but the potential servicing/repair rigmarole puts me off.

I would take anything Archie Luxury says with a pinch of salt, he has to fill out his 10 mins somehow.
It's the same Foundation yes, but I meant that Tudor have a distinctive brand now and are no longer thought of as the cheaper version of Rolex. I think the Tudor GMT is a retrograde step as it is very obviously inspired by Rolex Pepsi GMT's. I prefer it when Tudor are being distinctive in their own right, the Flyback and Heritage Chrono's for example, nothing in the Rolex stable is comparable.

The Steinhart's Sub clones are probably as good as it gets on the homage front. Their early Daytona homages are dreadful, big thick plexi-glass monstrosities. If you see them side-on on a wrist they're unbelievably ugly.

The Grand Seiko Quartz is supposed to go 50 years inbetween services! Although you won't get that out of the battery. I understand the mechanical Grand Seiko's can only be serviced by Seiko by a few of their master watchmakers. I expect the costs and waiting times will be comparable with Rolex.
 

formby

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It's the same Foundation yes, but I meant that Tudor have a distinctive brand now and are no longer thought of as the cheaper version of Rolex. I think the Tudor GMT is a retrograde step as it is very obviously inspired by Rolex Pepsi GMT's. I prefer it when Tudor are being distinctive in their own right, the Flyback and Heritage Chrono's for example, nothing in the Rolex stable is comparable.

The Steinhart's Sub clones are probably as good as it gets on the homage front. Their early Daytona homages are dreadful, big thick plexi-glass monstrosities. If you see them side-on on a wrist they're unbelievably ugly.

The Grand Seiko Quartz is supposed to go 50 years inbetween services! Although you won't get that out of the battery. I understand the mechanical Grand Seiko's can only be serviced by Seiko by a few of their master watchmakers. I expect the costs and waiting times will be comparable with Rolex.
Well, I'm not a fan of the 'Pepsi' is either guise. but the Tudor is perhaps an interesting alternative.

As for homage watches I consider them little more than fake. Every time I see one, I have a Mr Kurtz on his deathbed moment.
 

prince nez

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I like Grand Seiko, especially their snowflake, but the potential servicing/repair rigmarole puts me off.
It’s never going to be as good as Rolex in the UK and elsewhere but who is? Have heard some horror stories from people returning Richmont brands for service for example, and have had poor experiences myself with authorised local service centres for watches with just modified ETA movements, so I don’t think GS would be much better or worse than the majority of the industry in terms of customer satisfaction.

Personally I’m not too fussed if it takes 6 weeks to get my watch serviced every 5 years, particularly as there is something romantic to think it will go back to the individual watchmaker who first assembled it.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I picked-up the Grand Seiko Quartz, the last of the old logo version with the Seiko beneath the 12 position:

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What can I say beyond mere speed induced hyperbole?

The nearest comparable watch as regards case, dial and bracelet would be the old Rolex Air Kings. It cost me €2000 which I think is great value for this level of quality and understated refinment. As the entry level Grand Seiko, it's pretty much flawless.
 

Kingstonian

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My Seiko Quartz produced December 1979.

Similar bracelet style. ‘SQ’ where ‘Grand Seiko’ appears.

With the occasional battery change it has worked well.

A canny buy.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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View attachment 29345

My Seiko Quartz produced December 1979.

Similar bracelet style. ‘SQ’ where ‘Grand Seiko’ appears.

With the occasional battery change it has worked well.

A canny buy.
Affordable quality, what's not to like?

The longevity of quartz is often questioned, but you see lots of fine examples from the 70s still going strong and for top dollar with the Oysterquartz models. I have my Longines Conquest from '89 which my mother-in-law has, and has had maybe only 3 battery changes in that period and no services.

My eldest was right on the Grand Seiko today and said they'll have it if I ever get bored of it. I've not had a buzz from a material possession at this level since I had the Jaguar. It really induces a pure aesthetic delight.
 

ConchitaWurst

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Thruth

thicker but more pliant than horsehide
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Rambo

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Pimpernel Smith

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Not ugly, but I have price expectations for the Citizen brand. They stop well before a couple of grand. Same for Seiko. Both excellent watch brands.
Citizen have recently purchased the Dutch watch group consisting of Frederique Constant, Alpina and the luxury watch maker Ateliers deMonaco. The first two brands are specialised in getting the biggest bang for your buck and in the case of the upper ranges of Frederique Constant doing elaborate and complex movements for half the price of comparable watchs from other brands.

Wafer thin ugliness
You need to look at with appreciation of the craft in the design and metallurgy of it. You look at Rado which has so called ultra thin ranges with unique composite materials and it's clear Citizen have pushed the envelope much further.

The other factor is wafer watches are pretty much out of fashion these days. You've got the two luxury mechanical watches from Piaget and Bulgari, then what have you got? You've the cheap and cheery Skagen and Dunhill did a decent wafer watch back in the 2000's, but other than that there's nothing. So Citizen is quite bold with this watch. I think it looks great.

Watch brothers,

Which brand best says that you can be bought?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...watch-brother-gets-time-idUSBRE9840AC20130905

Subsequent crash has helped all you more honest people to buy overstock at condition zero apparently. Code for brand new, unworn, box and papers - but not from the official dealer.

I will be discrete in wearing my bribe watch.
You should be careful as people are not blind or daft when it comes to gratuitous displays of luxury watches. The company I know of that was bribing staff in a European oil company got found out when junior oil company staff started to turn up at work with Rolexes and sports cars. You might get away with one, but not both at the same time and not one, but two or more individuals suddenly turning up in the company car park with a Porsche and flashing your Daytona around in the work canteen.

Bribes and kick-backs need to be handled discretely and with care.
 

doghouse

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It’s never going to be as good as Rolex in the UK and elsewhere but who is? Have heard some horror stories from people returning Richmont brands for service for example, and have had poor experiences myself with authorised local service centres for watches with just modified ETA movements, so I don’t think GS would be much better or worse than the majority of the industry in terms of customer satisfaction.

Personally I’m not too fussed if it takes 6 weeks to get my watch serviced every 5 years, particularly as there is something romantic to think it will go back to the individual watchmaker who first assembled it.
I honestly have never had any of the servicing issues that people seem to have with any watch I've owned. Then again, I'm not one of those people like Foo, whose every transaction of their life is an insane ordeal.
 
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