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doghouse

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You know we don't even make money off the premiums you send over. The premiums received are invested and those investments generate a return on investment which generate profit for the company. The premium (money in) versus claim (money out) surplus is just used to pay for toilet paper, drinks, dinners and entertainment.
Not terribly fussed about whatever you do with it, my goal is to give you less of it.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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In Iceland they've just brought in new legislation that men and women must be paid the same. Fair enough, surprised this isn't the case already. But here's the catch: any company employing more than 25 people must undergo a compliance audit and after which they are awarded a certificate to demonstrate that men and women are paid the same. Madness.
 

Journeyman

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In Iceland they've just brought in new legislation that men and women must be paid the same. Fair enough, surprised this isn't the case already. But here's the catch: any company employing more than 25 people must undergo a compliance audit and after which they are awarded a certificate to demonstrate that men and women are paid the same. Madness.
Difficult and troublesome to enforce - what happens if one person (regardless of sex) is a hard worker and so has been given pay rises over the, say, three years they've been at the company but another person does the minimum and so has only got one pay rise in the last six years? Should they be paid the same?

Ultimately, as I understand it, disparity in pay between men and women is not simply because women are being discriminated against in the workforce, although I would argue that discrimination does still exist. Instead, it's largely because women take time off to have children and then usually go back to work part-time after the birth of the child. As a consequence, they tend to miss out on promotions and other opportunities, whereas men who have a largely uninterrupted work history don't miss out on those opportunities.

If we want to get rid of pay disparity, we need to look at changing societal attitudes - make it more acceptable for men to have time off after the birth of a child, give men access to parental leave and so on. Until that happens, pay disparity will still exist.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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Difficult and troublesome to enforce - what happens if one person (regardless of sex) is a hard worker and so has been given pay rises over the, say, three years they've been at the company but another person does the minimum and so has only got one pay rise in the last six years? Should they be paid the same?

Ultimately, as I understand it, disparity in pay between men and women is not simply because women are being discriminated against in the workforce, although I would argue that discrimination does still exist. Instead, it's largely because women take time off to have children and then usually go back to work part-time after the birth of the child. As a consequence, they tend to miss out on promotions and other opportunities, whereas men who have a largely uninterrupted work history don't miss out on those opportunities.

If we want to get rid of pay disparity, we need to look at changing societal attitudes - make it more acceptable for men to have time off after the birth of a child, give men access to parental leave and so on. Until that happens, pay disparity will still exist.
There's a whiff of inventing yet another certification standard to adhere to. Good money for the certification bodies.

What will they check: job description, titles are in alignment and check salary statements of men and women. Plenty of get outs: add responsibilities to job descriptions, invent new titles, etc.
 

Fwiffo

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Jesus, didn't realise it was bigger than Germany’s trade surplus - judging by your drinks, dinners and entertainment expenses.
That's because we use technicalities in the policy to argue out of paying claims and/or use a fleet of lawyers to help us deny the claim.
 

Fwiffo

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My boss has been adamant the final performance panel to review 2017 staff before we get rid of reviews is still being held. I said I received a move of the meeting and then a subsequent cancellation. I go up to the admin for the VP of HR and she cheerily tells me, "Oh there is a panel but it's not something you need to worry about..." - like I'm an illegal alien all of a sudden.
 
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My boss has been adamant the final performance panel to review 2017 staff before we get rid of reviews is still being held. I said I received a move of the meeting and then a subsequent cancellation. I go up to the admin for the VP of HR and she cheerily tells me, "Oh there is a panel but it's not something you need to worry about..." - like I'm an illegal alien all of a sudden.
I used to get into your situation before so putting in your shoes, I suggest you to ask them directly whats going on. In my past, I decided to stay silent, ignored their decisions and one day i got kicked out for lacking team composition (wtf)
 

Fwiffo

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I used to get into your situation before so putting in your shoes, I suggest you to ask them directly whats going on. In my past, I decided to stay silent, ignored their decisions and one day i got kicked out for lacking team composition (wtf)
It's quite simple. I'm getting demoted two levels in a few months. If this was a few decades ago I'd lose access to the executive floor to ask the question.

What's the professional way of going forward? Doing your job whilst finding a way out. Moaning about it and making a drama out of it won't win me any favours during my remaining time here or any future where my paths may cross with these people.
 

Fwiffo

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Indeed. Never had a legitimate pay cut, but I have had my contract terminated with extreme prejudice.
No I don't get a pay cut. There is little to no bonus this year because of the hurricanes and wildfires last year but I get to keep my title to qualify for a higher bonus. The pay will be the same but unless I jump two levels I will never get a pay increase.
 

Fwiffo

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What's a good opening line on LinkedIn if you found an AVP job that reports into a VP CxO of a secondary division in a big insurance conglomerate?

I haven't spoken to the man in 12 years. We used to do happy hour drinks through a mutual friend and he bounced some contracts over that I acted an intermediary so the mutual friend could charge more. He was GM at the time. I saw him go to a mortgage and cheque firm and now he seems to have made the jump from actuary to a higher title.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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So I closed this company down that was basically a vanity project for one of the ex-directors and repatriated the bank balance into the lead business here. Now I find that this money has become a debt I owe the Group as they were the owner. Bugger!
 

fxh

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What's a good opening line on LinkedIn if you found an AVP job that reports into a VP CxO of a secondary division in a big insurance conglomerate?

I haven't spoken to the man in 12 years. We used to do happy hour drinks through a mutual friend and he bounced some contracts over that I acted an intermediary so the mutual friend could charge more. He was GM at the time. I saw him go to a mortgage and cheque firm and now he seems to have made the jump from actuary to a higher title.
Cant believe its 12 years ago. Lets have a happy hour drink to commemorate the good times.
 

Fwiffo

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I need to be better at ringing people back. This human resources person said ring back if I don't hear on Friday. I call first thing this morning and the voicemail is a woman - female auto attendant? I swear the telephone screen was with a bloke named Daniel. Unless this woman was into heavy duty hormone treatment - or voice versa.
 

Fwiffo

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The president of the line of business that we roll up to in Germany opened my division town hall by saying, "I drove to building A and waited for you but noticed it was empty and there was a lot of parking. Then I realised you moved."

I don't know whether that is humour (German?) or a horrible opening line to tell us I don't even remember where your division is. Some time into the meeting he said this line of business has been delivering 3B profit to the conglomerate for 15 years and now we are at 2B.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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The president of the line of business that we roll up to in Germany opened my division town hall by saying, "I drove to building A and waited for you but noticed it was empty and there was a lot of parking. Then I realised you moved."

I don't know whether that is humour (German?) or a horrible opening line to tell us I don't even remember where your division is. Some time into the meeting he said this line of business has been delivering 3B profit to the conglomerate for 15 years and now we are at 2B.
Be thankful the management isn't French or Romanian. There's no joking with them, just constant bullying and sackings of anyone who dares step out of line with the manager's position.
 

Fwiffo

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That is indeed genuine German (attempt at) humor.
Yes the Germans are a real gas olólololze!
I'm prone to sarcastic insensitive remarks but I found that opening line incredibly tone deaf given what he was about to speak on. I thought at that level you need to have some basic civility and not come off as a caricature from a television show.

Be thankful the management isn't French or Romanian. There's no joking with them, just constant bullying and sackings of anyone who dares step out of line with the manager's position.
No, but our CxO is an Englishman. He made it quite clear he won't be learning German. He said something to the effect of if you are talking about him, you can speak in German. If you want to talk to him, you have to speak English.

Being in Bavaria, there are more than a few Romanians working at the firm.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I
No, but our CxO is an Englishman. He made it quite clear he won't be learning German. He said something to the effect of if you are talking about him, you can speak in German. If you want to talk to him, you have to speak English.
I like that attitude, all of us have to survive Prussia one more time.
 

Fwiffo

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I keep ringing back this HR person after our initial telephone screen. He said two Fridays ago, ring back on Friday if you don't hear from me. I did last Monday. No reply. I did today again. No reply.

When do I give up? I think I'll try once more in a week and then set a two week follow up. I did have to go through 3 months of screening for this current job.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I keep ringing back this HR person after our initial telephone screen. He said two Fridays ago, ring back on Friday if you don't hear from me. I did last Monday. No reply. I did today again. No reply.

When do I give up? I think I'll try once more in a week and then set a two week follow up. I did have to go through 3 months of screening for this current job.
The secret of a successful job application is always to leap-frog over the HR people and deal with the line manager who will be over you. Then you stand a fighting chance. HR people should be relegated to preparing the contract and shuffling paper.
 

Fwiffo

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The secret of a successful job application is always to leap-frog over the HR people and deal with the line manager who will be over you. Then you stand a fighting chance. HR people should be relegated to preparing the contract and shuffling paper.
It's a bank that has 80-90K people and I honestly applied from the website so I'm surprised I even got a call back. I did reach out to the CxO of one of the divisions of a life insurer having known him and did work with him a decade ago but he's not open to giving me a chance at some executive position he has open. It was a stretch as it's a step up for me, but at least I tried. That was the biggest hitter in my Rolodex.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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It's a bank that has 80-90K people and I honestly applied from the website so I'm surprised I even got a call back. I did reach out to the CxO of one of the divisions of a life insurer having known him and did work with him a decade ago but he's not open to giving me a chance at some executive position he has open. It was a stretch as it's a step up for me, but at least I tried. That was the biggest hitter in my Rolodex.
Any advert on a website is always going to be a long shot. You're up against all the other candidates and too many filters. The best is word of mouth that someone is looking for someone, or about too, then you can declare your candidature early. Also some organisations have to advertise the position, even if they've already decided on someone internally, just to show it's all transparent and open. When of course it's not.
 

Fwiffo

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My boss suggested I do horizontal movement. Appraisal to be given to me on Monday. This other demoted work mate did it to transfer to another department and is losing his title. He had to fight to retain his pay. No idea why he's doing that given it's the same crap just a different pile.
 

Fwiffo

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I got the highest rating since I came back from the assignment in Atlanta and got promoted. Then I slowly figured out why. Apparently my ex boss is returning to the fatherland and leaving the firm altogether. This is my send off. He encouraged me to transfer to another department with a condescending attitude what would I do in the one I was placed in. I have yet to be approached by my new functional boss and it remains to be seen the one who approached someone who held my new title is even the right person. The new management structure is a shambles. The functional manager who controls him, for example, is being claimed by two people on a temporary basis until it is filled - just imagine you go on a teleconference and two people say you report into them.

I got the hard sell on the transfer again. When I said I would really have to think about it, he said my peer (said person on Thursday who divulged it to me) did it. But he didn't tell me he had to fight the firm to retain the same benefits, salary and lost out on the title.

I see my options as staying in my new department, keeping my title for the remainder of this performance period (1st Jan) and finding a new job. Maybe they figure out my job is 99.9% more than what they do and they give me a hard time, try to transfer me or make me apply for my own job.

Or this alternative - find a place to go and accept immediate demotion but survive and find a job without being harassed why I'm doing what I'm doing.

I'm going to go with the former.

Oh - my high rating does nothing for my bonus if it's multiplied by zero. Cheers - hurricanes and wildfires.
 
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Pimpernel Smith

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Our UK office was inadvertently Cc'd on an email this week from one of our competitors and one of the CV's rang an alarm bell and they contacted me as possibly I had some dealings with this English chap based in The Hague. And indeed I had, this was another chancer with a fake engineering degree, but the best bit of this version of his CV was the bold statement he had over 20 years experience in the summary and on the CV detailed a career commencing in 1995. Actually, his work experience stretches quite a way back beyond this....he was born in 1945!
 

Fwiffo

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Actually, his work experience stretches quite a way back beyond this....he was born in 1945!
Were you expecting him to detail it back to the 1960s? I honestly start ignoring most things other than company, years of service and title when you start scanning the CV before 1998. Honestly what could you do in 20 years that is still somewhat relevant to where you are today.
 

Fwiffo

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I passed the telephone screen and got an immediate interview slot. Then I did pretty well with the VP and the HR manager. If round 1 was good, round 2 was great and round 3 was last week with the future peers. The set up threw me off and some attendees trickling in or missing together meant I held back a bit. I would say I limped across the finish line in round 3. The interviewers were horrible at interviewing unlike the VP and HR folks. I was asked every round whether I can commit to oppressive work hours, be on call and travel. After round 2, I thought I could see myself in this place for three years until I get a major accomplishment on my CV. But the fact it came up again in round 3 makes me think I have to give up drinking and convert to Islam so I can fulfill my duties.

I came away from round 3 disgusted, but as I continue to waste away at this current job and see what authority I have diminish with every passing day I want to jump even if it's imperfect.

It has also been depressing since besides this bank, no one has reached out except a few headhunters on behalf of insurance firms.
 
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