Sartorial Stories In The News

doghouse

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The suit raises people up to the bourgeoisie or it reduces the rest of us including his lordship's morning dress and top hat down to the rabble?
Both, I believe is what they say.

The suit, democratic....?

Is it...?
I can see both sides of the argument.

But it does go to prove my point that people aren't equal, no matter what the box they are put in, some will be of higher ability than others.
 

formby

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Both, I believe is what they say.



I can see both sides of the argument.

But it does go to prove my point that people aren't equal, no matter what the box they are put in, some will be of higher ability than others.
MES interesting observation...(in bold)


I suspect that most people genuinely wouldn't be able to tell the difference, Fwiffo, and so it is semi-egalitarian. Same thing with school uniforms - at my (state) school everyone had the same black plastic trews and navy wool-blend blazer. I'm sure there are some who bought fancier shirts and trousers but nobody could really tell. Interestingly, I read a post by some SF member recently who said that at his (presumably private, or at least posh) school it was explicitly forbidden to have a bespoke blazer! That simply wouldn't have crossed the mind of any parent at my school, I believe - I may be totally wrong as it was a very, very mixed catchment area - you simple were given a very large jacket at 14 and grew into it.

Similarly, when I went to uni the salesman at M&S pushed my parents to get me an enormous suit with a mistaken expectation that I would grow into it. Now that I look back at dinner pictures, with what I know, I can see that it was a terrible fit and that some people around me clearly had very well-fitting (quite likely bespoke) clothes. At the time I didn't realise and felt no less equal to those people because we were all still in our lounge suits at dinners together.

Of course to them I probably looked like the middle class pleb that I am.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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People having been positing that the suit is the most democratic garment for at least 100 years now. Even our dear Pimpernel Smith Pimpernel Smith knows that.
Well, it's certainly defied all expectations of its imminent demise. One hopes democracy is too as sturdy.

The suit raises people up to the bourgeoisie or it reduces the rest of us including his lordship's morning dress and top hat down to the rabble?
Yes, it's either Citizen Smith or Citizen Kane.
 

Fwiffo

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If we all subscribe to this theory that a suit is the great social class equalizer, why stop there? Why not black tie? That has to be conformity par excellence. There are even less ways to express oneself unless you go for the six button polyester waistcoat decked out with a floral pattern.

Admittedly, the outfit is less versatile. People can still sweep the floor in a three piece but not in a tuxedo. What am I missing?
 

Pimpernel Smith

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The same could be said for a shirt, whilst the suit as a suit has been around for quite sometime, you wouldn't want to be seen in the height of suit fashion from say the early 70s would you? It's classic, but infinite variations.

If we all subscribe to this theory that a suit is the great social class equalizer, why stop there? Why not black tie? That has to be conformity par excellence. There are even less ways to express oneself unless you go for the six button polyester waistcoat decked out with a floral pattern.

Admittedly, the outfit is less versatile. People can still sweep the floor in a three piece but not in a tuxedo. What am I missing?
Class equalizer? I'm not so sure. Would you dress in a suit to be part of the mere herd?
 

doghouse

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If we all subscribe to this theory that a suit is the great social class equalizer
Do we? All I've seen here is people have heard it said that that is the case. I'm not sure any of us agree. As I said, at best I can see both sides of the argument.

I would say that the principle applies to black tie as well, maybe moreso. The whole point is conformity.
 

viaattovannucci

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If we all subscribe to this theory that a suit is the great social class equalizer, why stop there? Why not black tie? That has to be conformity par excellence. There are even less ways to express oneself unless you go for the six button polyester waistcoat decked out with a floral pattern.

Admittedly, the outfit is less versatile. People can still sweep the floor in a three piece but not in a tuxedo. What am I missing?
It seems that you are collapsing the notion of egalitarianism with that of societal norms and of uniform with conformity. At any rate, the equality that is at issue in the article is presumed to be one among peers, not everyone. And even then I don’t really agree. When everyone is dressed in a “uniform” in a white-collar setting, it is often the “narcissism of small differences” that takes hold. People obsess over all sorts of little details, and #menswear forums are the best examples of this.

None of this really matters anymore, of course, since there are barely workplace uniforms for anyone and the suit is hardly anymore the social norm.
 
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doghouse

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Jupiter

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Unfortunately the Barbour global offer has become a jungle with the trendiness of the brand, knowing the usual marketing fragmentation and denaturation of old brands living a fashion revival. Only the great classics - waxed jackets and lambswool knitwear - still made in England are worth the price. I fear the Igents passion for Barbour will lead to a Vuitton bag effect and a complete loss of meaning in a near future.
 

Scherensammler

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Unfortunately the Barbour global offer has become a jungle with the trendiness of the brand, knowing the usual marketing fragmentation and denaturation of old brands living a fashion revival. Only the great classics - waxed jackets and lambswool knitwear - still made in England are worth the price. I fear the Igents passion for Barbour will lead to a Vuitton bag effect and a complete loss of meaning in a near future.
Just wait! If they're smart there will eventually be images of the newly-wed Royal couple wearing the iconic British brand on their honeymoon.
That is actually a great opportunity to make Brexit a success story.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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Unfortunately the Barbour global offer has become a jungle with the trendiness of the brand, knowing the usual marketing fragmentation and denaturation of old brands living a fashion revival. Only the great classics - waxed jackets and lambswool knitwear - still made in England are worth the price. I fear the Igents passion for Barbour will lead to a Vuitton bag effect and a complete loss of meaning in a near future.
I'm old enough to remember the last peak Barbour over saturation which was the time of the Sloane Ranger and within 18 months everyone was wearing a wax jacket and then the inflection point was reached with a sheer drop into staleness that lasted throughout the 90s.

The delta of fashion is too wide now for this ever to be repeated me thinks.

At present, Barbour is too well known without the cache of being overtly priced at the level of status symbol or some other provenance of rarity, or having to be found through sartorial adventures off the beaten track.

I think Barbour is quite safe. The prices seem to me, to be the same, if not cheaper than they were in the late 80s, I may be wrong.

NY Times’ Caramanica on J. Press: https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/01/10/fashion/j-press-preppy-shopping-new-york.html?referer=

Not that I am a J. Press fanboy, but this guy proves that he is a badtaster at every turn.
J.Press sport jackets and blazers are superb RTW action. I'm a fan, albeit the hideous import duties really put a dampener on them.
 

viaattovannucci

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I'm old enough to remember the last peak Barbour over saturation which was the time of the Sloane Ranger and within 18 months everyone was wearing a wax jacket and then the inflection point was reached with a sheer drop into staleness that lasted throughout the 90s.

The delta of fashion is too wide now for this ever to be repeated me thinks.

At present, Barbour is too well known without the cache of being overtly priced at the level of status symbol or some other provenance of rarity, or having to be found through sartorial adventures off the beaten track.

I think Barbour is quite safe. The prices seem to me, to be the same, if not cheaper than they were in the late 80s, I may be wrong.



J.Press sport jackets and blazers are superb RTW action. I'm a fan, albeit the hideous import duties really put a dampener on them.
I suppose the distinction between a fan and fanboy is illusory on my part. I am a fan as well; I had just meant that I am not irrationally lining up in defense of a particular brand. I like many of their products, too, though admittedly my selection is mostly confined to their furnishings (OCBDs, especially).

It is just that his whole spiel about the supposed rigidity of J. Press cut and his uncouth opinion about cords irked me a little. Well, quite a bit actually, now that I think about it!
 

Kingstonian

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I'm old enough to remember the last peak Barbour over saturation which was the time of the Sloane Ranger and within 18 months everyone was wearing a wax jacket and then the inflection point was reached with a sheer drop into staleness that lasted throughout the 90s.
Me too. I have always hated them but they were seen beyond the green welly brigade for a good while. Horrible fabric. Much vaunted rain proofing is not much good if the wet simply falls straight onto your thighs. Drizabone is overkill but at least your legs don’t get wet. There is more stylish and sensible rainwear but Barbour is seen on toffs. So monkey does as monkey sees.

Sizeable North American market to tap into and unlikely to create a similar reaction. So they will be OK.
 

rdiaz

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I have Barbour lambswool scarves. Never liked their waxed jackets all that much. Some old, aged ones look nice, but that's about it.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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Me too. I have always hated them but they were seen beyond the green welly brigade for a good while. Horrible fabric. Much vaunted rain proofing is not much good if the wet simply falls straight onto your thighs. Drizabone is overkill but at least your legs don’t get wet. There is more stylish and sensible rainwear but Barbour is seen on toffs. So monkey does as monkey sees.

Sizeable North American market to tap into and unlikely to create a similar reaction. So they will be OK.
There's a climate issue here, what goes down in the damp yet relatively mild climate of the UK, will not cut the mustard in an US or Canadian continental mid-winter. They're not that very popular over here either, but the weather in the winter is generally ideal for Barbour's.
 

Rambo

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their statement in the email

A Letter to Our Customers

Since 1912, our mission has been to sell high-quality products that inspire and enable people to enjoy the outdoors. Our commitment to customer service has earned us your trust and respect, as has our guarantee, which ensures that we stand behind everything we sell.

Increasingly, a small, but growing number of customers has been interpreting our guarantee well beyond its original intent. Some view it as a lifetime product replacement program, expecting refunds for heavily worn products used over many years. Others seek refunds for products that have been purchased through third parties, such as at yard sales.

Based on these experiences, we have updated our policy. Customers will have one year after purchasing an item to return it, accompanied by proof of purchase. After one year, we will work with our customers to reach a fair solution if a product is defective in any way.

This update adds clarity to our policy and will only affect a small percentage of returns. It will also ensure we can continue to honor one of the best guarantees in retail, with no impact for the vast majority of our customers. To learn more, please view our full return policy at llbean.com.

L.L.Bean has stood for quality, service, trust, and getting people outdoors ever since my great-grandfather founded our company over 100 years ago - and that will never change. Thank you for being a loyal customer and we look forward to continuing to inspire and enable you to Be an Outsider.
 

Journeyman

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Well, it's because of people acting like dicks.

I remember when I was young, a department store here used to offer a very generous return policy. I heard (apocryphally, so it may be untrue) of people who would purchase large-screen TVs for sporting events like the Olympics, and then return them for a full refund a few weeks later.

Unsurprisingly, the very generous return policy was canned and for many years now they've had the standard policy of having to prove that something is defective if you want a refund/replacement.

As usual, it's the selfish jerks who ruin it for the rest of us!
 

Rambo

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Well, it's because of people acting like dicks.

I remember when I was young, a department store here used to offer a very generous return policy. I heard (apocryphally, so it may be untrue) of people who would purchase large-screen TVs for sporting events like the Olympics, and then return them for a full refund a few weeks later.

Unsurprisingly, the very generous return policy was canned and for many years now they've had the standard policy of having to prove that something is defective if you want a refund/replacement.

As usual, it's the selfish jerks who ruin it for the rest of us!
https://www.bostonglobe.com/busines...tml?s_campaign=bostonglobe:socialflow:twitter

Check out the pics
 

fxh

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Well, it's because of people acting like dicks.

I remember when I was young, a department store here used to offer a very generous return policy. I heard (apocryphally, so it may be untrue) of people who would purchase large-screen TVs for sporting events like the Olympics, and then return them for a full refund a few weeks later.

Unsurprisingly, the very generous return policy was canned and for many years now they've had the standard policy of having to prove that something is defective if you want a refund/replacement.

As usual, it's the selfish jerks who ruin it for the rest of us!
David Jones?

Well known that people - mainly women - would get an outfit or two for Cup Week - Oaks day etc then return it.

Years ago, when DJs had decent shoes - I worked with a bloke - an old school camp bloke - the only other bloke I knew who was interested in clothes - who used to buy a pair of shoes he liked - take them to the famous Roccos - get them copied cheaply by Rocco then take them back to DJs unworn for refund.
 

Journeyman

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Check out the pics
The amazing thing is that morons are saying "Goodbye, LL Bean - I'll never shop at you again!"

You can still return anything for any reason within a year, and then return items after that if they are defective. That's still a far better return policy than 99% of stores.

Interestingly, Land's End still has an open-ended returns policy - you can return anything, at any time, and receive a refund. I remember receiving an LE catalogue some years back that included a story of someone who had bought a London taxi from an old Land's End Christmas catalogue (odd, but apparently true) and then, two or three decades later, had contacted LE to ask about returning the taxi. LE accepted it and gave them a refund.
 

ConchitaWurst

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azn haberdashers taking direct inspiration from via chiaia

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after extremely promissing bruce boyer x marol collab, both the armoury and brycelands will be launching their own swastika capsule collection currated by marchese parisi

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ConchitaWurst

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apparently m brosi has been to istanbul recently. not to sell pants at eur 1k a pop, but for an important transplant. look at the ultra soft cashmere like down fur on his head. he can already comb a little bit of a parting

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The Shooman

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Great stories by Mr Logsdail. Highly recommended video.

bespoke tailor Leonard Logsdail got sacked over and over again from so many tailoring houses that he eventually went out on his own, but he also got rejected by clients where one said "God's work is perfect, yours is not".

 
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