Coronavirus

fxh said:
I had like a mild hangover nausea, headaches the next day. That’s with AZ.
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Well, when I say 'ill' what I really mean is a tad off-colour...

I never use the word ill in front of the delightful and ever-fragrant Ms Formby.
 
Pimpernel Smith said:
Much tighter here, being an insurance system, that's free at the point of access only if you're poor or unemployed.

The vaccines are all emergency use only, we're all part of an experiment. That's why kids should be exempt, particularly as the vaccine poses more risk than the virus.
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Poop all you like, but my position is valid: you boast about the software databases that provide a tight ring around the inoculated and if it turns out - there are worrying health trends - you can contact those at risk. But those inoculated with no ID and undocumented who cannot be traced, what health security for them?

Clearly none. That system whilst beaming with the quick fix of moral buzz and warm feelings in the gut, isn't part of the scientific method at all. Which should be applied to these vaccines.
 
I don’t think you understand how health records and vaccine registries work.

Do you have to show your drivers’ license and proof of citizenship who you go to the Doctor? Or do they just have your contact details on file that you provided?
 
Dropbear said:
I don’t think you understand how health records and vaccine registries work.

Do you have to show your drivers’ license and proof of citizenship who you go to the Doctor? Or do they just have your contact details on file that you provided?
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I'm looking at it from interrogating data. If you're missing a pool of those you've vaccinated from a contact and trace perspective then you may have issues if subsequently health risks are identified against one or more vaccine. I suppose part and parcel when you have massive amounts of undocumented illegal aliens who are half-in-and-half-out the system.

If I go to a specialist, or visit the emergency ward, they will expect proof of identity with photo and insurance. If I can't provide, certainly for a non-emergency specialist visit, they will turn me away. In the case of real emergency, I will be walking away with the bill and on trying to leave the Netherlands, or certainly on re-entering I will be accosted at customs and be expected to pay the full amount duly owed. If I have credit cards and the like on me, I will be expected to use them to pay the fees of the medical services there and then at the point of usage.
 
We are not missing significant data, aside from people’s immigration status - which is of no concern to the clinician providing the service.

That’s bizarre that you need to show ID just to see a doctor. Do you have to show ID to go the the dentist as well? What about kids who don’t have a driver’s license?
 
Dropbear said:
That’s bizarre that you need to show ID just to see a doctor. Do you have to show ID to go the the dentist as well? What about kids who don’t have a driver’s license?
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The GP I don't have to show ID, as they know me, same with the dentist. But on registering you do and they will expect that. You won't be able to register without ID and proof that you have insurance. You don't need to be a national, I'm not, but you need proof of identity and medical insurance. Edit: And your BSN(Tax) and Social Security number.

Different with voting, when you go to vote, you have to show proof of identity each and every time. It's not considered Jim Crow here, far from it.

What's considered bizarre in the States and to some extent in the UK, is considered sound due diligence and process over here. And this is a real welfare state.
 
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It is inevitable full reopening as expected on June 21 in the UK will be delayed by at least four weeks.

This seems to be a never-ending nightmare.
 
QuandoDio said:
It is inevitable full reopening as expected on June 21 in the UK will be delayed by at least four weeks.

This seems to be a never-ending nightmare.
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You've got to find a way out of it, or indeed it will never end. Every flu season will be the same.

Watched that SAGE communist lady getting interviewed last week (what the hell she's doing advising government?), and she said masks need to stay mandatory forever when people go outside in public or any building, or school. The whole scheme to isolate individuals further.
 
Pimpernel Smith said:
You've got to find a way out of it, or indeed it will never end. Every flu season will be the same.

Watched that SAGE communist lady getting interviewed last week (what the hell she's doing advising government?), and she said masks need to stay mandatory forever when people go outside in public or any building, or school. The whole scheme to isolate individuals further.
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Dear God no. Are we back to that new normal rubbish?
 
fxh said:
I had like a mild hangover nausea, headaches the next day.
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formby002 said:
Well, when I say 'ill' what I really mean is a tad off-colour...

I never use the word ill in front of the delightful and ever-fragrant Ms Formby.
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I imagine when an Englishman as refined and restrained as yourself says I was “a tad off colour” I assume you were in ICU and the priest gave you the last rites. Glad you pulled through.
 
fxh said:
I imagine when an Englishman as refined and restrained as yourself says I was “a tad off colour” I assume you were in ICU and the priest gave you the last rites. Glad you pulled through.
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Most kind of you...
 
www.nbcnews.com

More young adults than expected have reported heart inflammation following Covid-19 vaccination

The condition, called myocarditis, is usually mild, but a handful of patients remain hospitalized.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com

"A higher-than-usual number of cases of a type of heart inflammation has been reported following Covid-19 vaccination, especially among young men following their second dose of an mRNA vaccine, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said Thursday."

I hope Pfizer and Moderna have better PR people than AstraZeneca.
 
Pimpernel Smith said:
There are many disturbing elements to this virus, but none of it justifies what is a global experiment in inoculation for all vaccines that have leap-frogged the normal extensive testing.
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Apparently the phase III trial of the Biontech vaccine was one of the largest ever done for a vaccine.
 
www.bbc.com

Covid: US death toll passes 600,000 as vaccination rate slows

Amid falling vaccination rates, the US maintains global records for both total cases and deaths.
www.bbc.com

"Ohio has been selecting one vaccinated resident each week to win $1m (£708,000). On Tuesday, California will give $1.5m each to 10 residents. Other winnable items include alcohol, cannabis, guns, food vouchers and gift cards."

What would I do with a gun?
 
güero said:
Apparently the phase III trial of the Biontech vaccine was one of the largest ever done for a vaccine.
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Large in numbers, but not in time. That's my only worry. But the say the data modelling is so advanced they don't need to wait as long before approving vaccines.
 
In Germany, the Federal Auditors (auditing the use of tax money) reported already in January to the government, that the ICU bed and utilization numbers were to a large degree fake. Something anyone with half a brain cell knew just by looking at the data in November/December. Those fake numbers where then used as justification for completely unnecessary closures etc. This is such an incredible slow-motion trainwreck, I still find it hard to believe it’s actually happening.
 
Dropbear said:
Speaking of train wrecks ….

Bloomberg - Are you a robot?

www.bloomberg.com
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Don’t think having less deaths than many/most other countries in Europe qualifies as a train wreck, but if preventing deaths is the overall goal (which it shouldn’t be, but forget about that) rather qualifies as successful policy, quote from the article:

More recently, the government has pointed to data showing that Sweden had a lower rate of excess deaths than most European countries during 2020.
 
güero said:
In Germany, the Federal Auditors (auditing the use of tax money) reported already in January to the government, that the ICU bed and utilization numbers were to a large degree fake. Something anyone with half a brain cell knew just by looking at the data in November/December. Those fake numbers where then used as justification for completely unnecessary closures etc. This is such an incredible slow-motion trainwreck, I still find it hard to believe it’s actually happening.
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It’s actually even worse, the auditors just quote from a letter the RKI (German CDC) sent to the government, claiming the ICU numbers cannot be used anymore to assess the situation. Yet, of course they were used because why wouldn’t you use made-up numbers. That’s standard government practice anywhere.
 
Chris Paul, NBA superstar, caught covid after having been vaccinated and might be out for the conference finals. No word yet on which vaccine brand he got.
 
Rush hour traffic's back to normal, so some people are evidently back in the office and not following the Dutch government's instruction that you should only be in the office for presentations or training:

IMG_2454.jpg
 
Rambo said:
Chris Paul, NBA superstar, caught covid after having been vaccinated and might be out for the conference finals. No word yet on which vaccine brand he got.
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They never said it was 100 percent effective.

I think the most disappointed would be that golfer that withdrew after day 3 after a positive test and was more than a handful of strokes ahead of everyone else.
 
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I thought vaccines were supposed to be the big deciding factor. Unless Italy somehow outpaced Britain in inoculation.
 
Fwiffo said:
They never said it was 100 percent effective.

I think the most disappointed would be that golfer that withdrew after day 3 after a positive test and was more than a handful of strokes ahead of everyone else.
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I don’t think anyone’s ever claimed it was X% effective at preventing infection, they only said it’s effective at preventing grave hospitalization and death. Might be wrong, but that’s how I understood it.
 
güero said:
I don’t think anyone’s ever claimed it was X% effective at preventing infection, they only said it’s effective at preventing grave hospitalization and death.
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Vaccination doesn't make you invulnerable to contracting the infection - it just means that you have pre-existing antibodies so your body fights it off very effectively and, in general, you don't get very sick at all.

So a person can be vaccinated and yet still be infected and still transmit an infection to others. However, because the infection should be very mild (due to the vaccination), the period in which they're carrying the disease should be considerably shorter.

That's my amateur understanding, anyway.
 
Journeyman said:
Vaccination doesn't make you invulnerable to contracting the infection - it just means that you have pre-existing antibodies so your body fights it off very effectively and, in general, you don't get very sick at all.

So a person can be vaccinated and yet still be infected and still transmit an infection to others. However, because the infection should be very mild (due to the vaccination), the period in which they're carrying the disease should be considerably shorter.

That's my amateur understanding, anyway.
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Yes that’s how I understood it as well, but I do have the impression it gets confused a lot in media and politics.
 
Journeyman said:
Vaccination doesn't make you invulnerable to contracting the infection - it just means that you have pre-existing antibodies so your body fights it off very effectively and, in general, you don't get very sick at all.

So a person can be vaccinated and yet still be infected and still transmit an infection to others. However, because the infection should be very mild (due to the vaccination), the period in which they're carrying the disease should be considerably shorter.

That's my amateur understanding, anyway.
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C19 severity of infection is related to the dose you inhale. If a vaccinated person gets the virus, they get it less severe and for a shorter time frame. So they cough/breathe less at others and for less days. So the infection picked up from them is in turn less severe. And likely less widespread.

Disclaimer. This is not a peer reviewed paper but an oversimplified explanation of one aspect of the disease.
 
www.bbc.com

UK Covid infections rise as Delta variant dominates

There is some regional variation in infection rates and some good news on vaccine efficacy.
www.bbc.com

"Of 806 people infected with the Delta variant who ended up hospital in England between 1 February and 14 June 2021:
  • 527 (65%) people were unvaccinated
  • 135 (17%) were more than 21 days after their first dose of vaccine
  • 84 (10%) were more than 14 days after their second dose
As of 14 June, there have been 73 deaths in England of people who were confirmed as having the Delta variant and who died within 28 days of a positive test, and of these:
  • 34 (47%) were unvaccinated
  • 10 (14%) were more than 21 days after their first dose of vaccine
  • 26 (36%) were more than 14 days after their second dose"

I'm still dying from the brown mutation after full vaccination?
 
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