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Thruth

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I found some of the references to specific brand items off putting. On one hand he writes as if Preps only wear Barbour and no one else. Later he makes reference to other products that are worn by Preps and others. Probably just something overlooked prior to printing.

I've noticed other errors in email communication such as "when people red my e-book Gentlemen of Style...."
 

Jan Libourel

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My brother-in-law attended Philips-Exeter, which for those not in the know, is about the ne plus ultra of American prep schools. This would have been circa 1970. His father attended Exeter in the 1930s, and his grandfather was a master there for about 30 years. I asked him if they wore "preppy" attire when he was there--lots of pink, lime green, patch madras, etc. He replied, "Good Lord, no. This was 1970. We were all in jeans. That stuff was all a creation of the Official Preppy Handbook." I will say that we did use the term "preppy" jocularly when I was at prep school in the 1950s.

I believe the movie "Love Story" did much to popularize the term. When I mentioned having seen the movie, my best friend remarked, "When it was over, did your date say, 'Let's go, Preppy?'" At the end of the movie, as poor Jenny was dying, everyone in the theater was weeping, it seemed...except me. I had to choke down my laughter at the grief over the demise of that obnoxious girl. I asked my pal what he thought of someone who laughed through the end of "Love Story." "A heartless brute," he replied. "Alternatively, a man of refined sensibility. In your case, BOTH!"

On a different note, if anyone is on the quest for the "perfect popover," Mercer offers them. Mercer shirts are very hard to beat if you like their style, I think.
 

Allen Smithee

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Preppy as a derogatory term starts wandering pretty far of the reservation. In the classic television Saved by the Bell, Mario Lopez's AC Slater character would refer to Marc-Paul Gosselar as such.

Preppy?

I always heard that Mercer was way baggy. Does Ratio do popovers?
 

doghouse

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Preppy has been derogatory as long as I have been alive at least. Not that I would partake in such generalizations mind you.
 

Russell Street

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The OPH claimed that preppy was short for preposterous, IIRC.

What exactly is the intended use of the popover? I think historically, all shirts were essentially nightshirts. Is the popover purely a sport shirt, or for use with a tie? Is one in a finer fabric ridiculous?
 

Jan Libourel

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I always heard that Mercer was way baggy. Does Ratio do popovers?
Mercer is generously cut, but their reputation for bagginess is overblown compared to a lot of competitive product.

In my size (17 1/2), here are the lateral measurements for certain shirts laid flat, seam to seam at the bottoms of the armholes.

Vintage Ralph Lauren OCBD: 28.5"
Robert Talbott dress shirt: 27.5"
Mercer OCBD: 27.5"
Lands' End Hyde Park OCBD: 26.5"
W.W. Chan custom made shirts (slim fitting): 25.5"

Mercer shirts can be cut with a narrower body although this does add a modest surcharge to these already expensive shirts.
 

Russell Street

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Hey, Mr. Libourel was mentioning the rarified popover, and it turns out that a (totally inactive) member sells them. Needless to say, their shirts would be way slimmer than Mercer.
 

Jan Libourel

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It seems popovers are more popular than I thought. For instance, the ubiquitous J. Crew offers them. After this discussion yesterday, I began flirting with the idea of having Mercer make me up a popover shirt. However, after seeing some photos of popovers, I think I'll pass on that idea. They really don't appeal to me very much.
 

MFDoom

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I thought popovers were a kind of pastry. Learn something new every day.

Anyway, any blog discourse on prep without Muffy Aldrich's blog is worthless.
 

MFDoom

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jajajajajajaja she was SRS BZNESS about the details that make a Proper OCBD. Very OCD about it. But I appreciated her staunchness.
 

Russell Street

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jajajajajajaja she was SRS BZNESS about the details that make a Proper OCBD. Very OCD about it. But I appreciated her staunchness.
Oh, she knows her stuff and I generally agree. She's just so humorless. I mean I also think that certain things are just plain right, but I don't act like it's a matter of great moral travesty when shirt collars shorten
 

MFDoom

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Oh, she knows her stuff and I generally agree. She's just so humorless. I mean I also think that certain things are just plain right, but I don't act like it's a matter of great moral travesty when shirt collars shorten
Well goddammit you must stand for some Traditional Values in this crazy world!!!
 

Russell Street

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Saying that any woman is "humorless" is as redundant as saying a tiger is "carnivorous"!
Well, yeah, but she really doesn't seem to make any effort at affability or quirkiness or any such thing. She is the queen issuing her decrees.

As I am called upon to go to multiple, thoroughly unrelated, functions per day, I am again reminded of the fluidity from which the trad wardrobe allows one to switch between fairly casual to moderately formal.

Try that with a trendier wardrobe. Actually, people are trying. The result is an awkward mishmash of dark suits and white shirts with no ties, quilted vests under blazers, jeans with blown-out knees with shirt and tie like it's the '80s again...
 

Thruth

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Well, yeah, but she really doesn't seem to make any effort at affability or quirkiness or any such thing. She is the queen issuing her decrees.

As I am called upon to go to multiple, thoroughly unrelated, functions per day, I am again reminded of the fluidity from which the trad wardrobe allows one to switch between fairly casual to moderately formal.

Try that with a trendier wardrobe. Actually, people are trying. The result is an awkward mishmash of dark suits and white shirts with no ties, quilted vests under blazers, jeans with blown-out knees with shirt and tie like it's the '80s again...
It does lend itself to being flexible in dressing it up or down. Similar to what might be termed the country (English) look with tweed, corduroy or moleskins, no? Maybe the "academic" look is not as bad as people make it out to be.
 

Russell Street

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I'll say, at the least, that it's like driving around in third gear. It may be a stretch, not the best, but some Anglo-American country/Ivy look of khakis and OCBD with staid somewhat clunky shoes and the option to roll sleeves or add a semi-rustic and tie will generally get the job done.
 

Arnathor

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Not wanting to derail the Disagreeable thread there is some discussion of Ivy style between doghouse doghouse and myself. He brings in some pieces for casual wear, while I really like the oxford cloth button down and the classic khaki trouser. Ralph Lauren is a bit costume-y for my tastes, I like Brooks Brothers and Land's End. What are member's thoughts on Ivy/Prep?
 

doghouse

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Not wanting to derail the Disagreeable thread there is some discussion of Ivy style between doghouse doghouse and myself. He brings in some pieces for casual wear, while I really like the oxford cloth button down and the classic khaki trouser. Ralph Lauren is a bit costume-y for my tastes, I like Brooks Brothers and Land's End. What are member's thoughts on Ivy/Prep?
Russell Street Russell Street is an Ivy dude.
 

fxh

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Not wanting to derail the Disagreeable thread there is some discussion of Ivy style between doghouse doghouse and myself. He brings in some pieces for casual wear, while I really like the oxford cloth button down and the classic khaki trouser. Ralph Lauren is a bit costume-y for my tastes, I like Brooks Brothers and Land's End. What are member's thoughts on Ivy/Prep?
more later
 

Russell Street

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Ralph Lauren is a bit costume-y for my tastes, I like Brooks Brothers and Land's End. What are member's thoughts on Ivy/Prep?
I have a general aversion to Ralph Lauren, partially because I was around in the 80's when his stuff was totally unique and distinctive with more cache. Whenever I walk past his stuff in a mall, it does seem a bit too heavy on the twee side, and that's coming from my spectator/saddle shoe fun sock/lace ass.
I like Brooks ties. And their Shetland sweaters, which you can barely get anymore. I have limited experience with anything else. The one old OCBD I had of theirs turned me off with the schirred sleeve, the lack of a gauntlet button, and the vast body width. I know they have different fits now, but I think they're foreign-made.
Lands' End has fallen to very dicey levels of late, but the price is right, at least on clearance, and the stuff is usually tasteful and well-constructed. Their heavy favoring of that no-iron stuff and moving to shorter collars really killed a go-to source for cheap, good properly-sized shirts. But hardly a day goes by when I'm not wearing something from there. Ancient ratty khakis at the moment...
 

Journeyman

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Well, most polo shirts don't have button-down collars (although Uniqlo does have some with button-down collars, which I really like).

With pop-over shirts, it seems to be about 50-50.
 

Rambo

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Well, most polo shirts don't have button-down collars (although Uniqlo does have some with button-down collars, which I really like).

With pop-over shirts, it seems to be about 50-50.
I completely misread that. I thought he meant a polo without ANY buttons whatsoever. My bad.
 
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