Is The Discussion Of The Shitty Parts Of Islam Bigotry?

That Jonathan Hart is a tool "jihadists stop being jihadists because they see how nice and loving western people are"

ISIS, kill them with kindness
 
Thruth said:
That Jonathan Hart is a tool "jihadists stop being jihadists because they see how nice and loving western people are"

ISIS, kill them with kindness
Click to expand...

Yeah, after that Howard Dean comment, I've lost it completely for these types.
 
It is all Saudi Arabia's fault by seeding Wahhabism across Arab lands. Let them deal with it. Let America buy Saudi oil to give them the $$ for their fight on terrorism and Islamic militancy. Eventually the caliphate will encroach to closely to the Kingdom and something will be done.
 
Thruth said:
That Jonathan Hart is a tool "jihadists stop being jihadists because they see how nice and loving western people are"
Click to expand...
Wait, isn't that the exact argument used with Communism and racism? Send the Russkies blue jeans and Beatles tapes and capitalism takes hold. Whitey just needs to get some diversity in their community and their bigotry will melt away.

The contrary is absolutely true. Overbearing force, particularly afflicting innocents, is a major recruiting tool.
Terrorism is almost always about land, and forfeiting the land always leads to an immediate end in terror. Close Gitmo (and similar torture prisons) and pull all troops from the area and let Israel be the enemy.
 
Isn't the President trying to enlist the help of moderates to the cause?
 
Feinstein 'Torture Report' outs C. Martel as Islamophobe

Feinstein 'Torture Report' outs C. Martel as Islamophobe

Charles_Martel_Diane_Feinstein.jpg


Diane Feinstein's recently released report on controversial CIA interrogation practices indicts, not only the Bush administration, but also all previous administrations going back to the controversial leader of the Franks, Charles Martel, and his victory over the moderate Muslim community at Tours in 732 AD, which can only be described as a gross law enforcement misconduct and hate crime.

Citing inside information from medieval Latin and Arabic sources, the report prepared by Feinstein's staffers details a shocking degree of intolerance and Islamophobia on the part of Charles Martel's administration and the army of Franks, who countered the peaceful expansion of moderate Muslims into Europe via Spain with such violent hatred that historians suspect could only be explained by racist motives.

"Clearly this was racial profiling on part of the Frankish administration," determined Yale historian Dr. Hussein al-Isis. "Franks and other white Europeans were simply uncomfortable around brown Middle Easterners, no matter how harmless their intentions."

While mostly white contemporary historians crowed about a "Christian victory over Islam," understandably bitter and disaffected members of the Muslim community, victimized by Martel's extremist policies, were compelled to fend for themselves while retreating through the Pyrenees shouting, "Hands up, don't spear me!" and "Death to Infidels!" Through no fault of their own, villages were plundered and citizens killed by some of the elements within the otherwise peaceful group of Muslim protesters, who became radicalized as a result of racism and gross civil right violations.

"I was disgusted at what we uncovered," said an indignant Senator Diane Feinstein. "Instead of empathizing with the Muslim community and hearing their side of the story - instead of trying to find common ground and a mutually acceptable compromise through interfaith dialogue and negotiations, the bigoted leader of the Franks chose to kill the Muslim leader, Abdul Rahman al-Ghafiqi."

Battle_of_Tours_CHarles_Martel.jpg


"For this sickening display of barbarism," added Feinstein, "he received the nickname of Martel, meaning 'the Hammer,' and has continued to symbolize the greatest threat to world peace and harmony until his title "the Hammer" was passed to the Republican leader Tom Delay.

"We have only ourselves to blame for this mess," opined foreign policy expert and former presidential candidate, Ron Paul. "If Martel had not unilaterally meddled in Middle Eastern affairs, then there wouldn't have been any of that blowback. The fact that Islam was spreading by violent conquest a century before the Battle of Tours is a direct result of Martel's misguided foreign adventures."

At a White House press conference, President Obama informed reporters that "I just found out about the Battle of Tours while watching History Channel, and let me tell you, nobody is angrier about this than I am. I have asked our outgoing attorney general, Eric Holder, to immediately investigate Martel's activities, to get to the bottom of this issue, and if possible, to take legal action against Charles Martel and the Frankish Kingdom. We will not rest until we have a conviction."

Nevertheless, the president did appeal for restraint. "As you protest, you're probably thinking like I'm thinking: this is the result of over a millennia of documentable Islamophobia. You know, this touches me on a personal level: Abdul Rahman al-Ghafiqi looks just like Michelle with a beard. This isn't just a Shia problem, or a Sunni problem, or a Sufi problem, it's an American problem. While I understand the rage, the calls for Jihad, the desire to impale all white Christians and burn down their churches, let's everybody stay calm and let social justice take its course."

Meanwhile, protesters holding posters of al-Ghafiqi were blocking major highways in large cities across America, and NFL players were seen charging onto the field, then collapsing and shouting, "Hands up, don't spear me!"

 

http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/topstories/why-barack-obama-won-t-say-islamic-extremists-1.2969404

Why Barack Obama won't say 'Islamic extremists'
President trying to channel the terror debate a certain way, but not everyone onside

ANALYSIS9:55 AM ETNeil Macdonald, CBC News
A few days after the 9/11 attacks, George W. Bush began repeating what would become a mandatory presidential preamble.

"The face of terror is not the true faith of Islam," he declared, then quoted from the Qur'an to make that case: "In the long run, evil in the extreme will be the end of those who do evil.

"Islam," Bush concluded, "is peace."

For the rest of his time as president, Bush was careful to use similar language in his denunciations of al-Qaeda and the Taliban. And when Barack Obama took over, he used an identical set of talking points.

Last week, speaking to a gathering of some 60 countries about the need to counter and destroy ISIS, the jihadist group running amok in Iraq and Syria, Obama couched his message in the same Islam-is-peace language, fishing out another quote from Islam's sacred text: "The Qur'an says whoever kills an innocent, it is as if he has killed all mankind."

Obama, in fact, goes even further than Bush did. To the annoyance of his critics, this president conspicuously avoids in his descriptions of ISIS and al-Qaeda any adjectives pertaining to their declared religious motivation.

Obama will not speak the words "Islamic," and "extremist" in the same breath. He will not use "Islamist," or even "jihadist."

Why Obama and some other Western leaders frame their rhetoric that way is obvious.

They want to shield law-abiding Muslim citizens from popular anger as provocations grow more atrocious by the month. Plus, they are anxious to repudiate any idea of a war between the largely Christian West and the Islamic world.

But that is the way ISIS and its fellow travellers see things, and those atrocities — the immolation of the Jordanian pilot in the name of Allah, the internet videos of hooded figures hacking the heads off Western hostages in the name of Allah, the slaughter at a French magazine in the name of Allah — are having the desired effect.

It's pretty safe to say that in the broad public mind, both here and in Europe, Islam is not synonymous with peace.



aptopix-american-islamic-state.jpg

Terri Crippes, left, and Lori Lyon, are the maternal aunts of Kayla Mueller, a 26-year-old American woman who had been held by Islamic State militants and was confirmed dead earlier this month. (The Associated Press)


And hovering above all the reassurances that the vast majority of Muslims reject religious extremism is the question of why so many violent religious extremists today are Muslims.

An answer, of sorts, is provided in a recent disquisition in The Atlantic, one of the oldest and most respected magazines in America.

The author, Graeme Wood, argues that whatever you might think of ISIS, it is following Qur'anic dictates.

The quotes extracted by George W. Bush and Obama do exist in the Qur'an, but so do plenty of others that are anything but peaceful.

A broader narrative
"Muslims can say that slavery is not legitimate now, and that crucifixion is wrong at this historical juncture," writes Wood. "Many say precisely this. But they cannot condemn slavery or crucifixion outright without contradicting the Qur'an and the example of the Prophet."

Wood argues that this limitation is what prevents many Muslims from speaking out against hardline Islamists.

The article is exhaustive, deeply researched, and quotes not just doctrinaire jihadists, but a widely respected Islamic scholar at Princeton University, as well as some of ISIS's supporters.



obama-us-britian.jpg

British Prime Minister David Cameron is one of those allies not avoiding the term 'Islamic extremism.' He deployed it again as recently as this week when talking about the three British school girls trying to make their way to Syria. (The Associated Press)


And it's provoking a public discussion here — on both the U.S. left and right — that a good many Americans have clearly been itching to have.

Reading the text of President Obama's speeches these past weeks, one suspects he read The Atlantic article, too, and that he's anxious to retain control over any such discussion.

Al-Qaeda and ISIS "draw selectively from the Islamic texts," Obama argues.

Having said that, though, he does concede there is "a broader narrative that does exist in many Muslim communities around the world that suggests the West is at odds with Islam in some fashion. Or that we are the cause of every ill in the Middle East."

That's not the case, the president said, adding that Muslim leaders, including scholars and clerics, need to do more to push back.

Basically, he was saying, if you aren't part of the solution, well … the conclusion is obvious.

Denunciations
Mainstream Western Muslim groups, one suspects, probably think they've already been as clear as they need to be about violence in the name of their God. And the conclusions in The Atlantic article are even less welcome.

Jerusha Tanner Lamptey, a professor of Islam and ministry at Union Theological Seminary in New York, was quoted by the group ThinkProgress as saying Wood's article in The Atlantic effectively portrayed all Muslims as archaic, backward-minded literalists, unable to accommodate the modern world.

Of course, if the most sacred texts of Islam contain some pretty unpeaceful passages, so does the Bible. The book of Leviticus, for example, outright condones slavery. The Old Testament preaches against homosexuality, and some of the punishments it prescribes for sinners are as savage as ones dispensed by ISIS.

Obama himself has pointed out recently that Christians have committed deeply evil acts in the name of Jesus, citing in particular the Crusades and the horrors of the Inquisition. (For this he took heavy criticism from Christian leaders, who cried false equivalence.)

The point he seems to be making is that no religion "is peace," in and of itself. Most religions in fact have adherents capable of fundamentalist, violent interpretations. At this point in history, Islam seems to have the most ferocious ones.



In any event, pretending that the likes of ISIS and al-Qaeda and al-Shabaab have nothing whatever to do with Islam is unpersuasive. Would anyone argue that the Crusaders, who butchered Jews and Muslims with equal enthusiasm, had nothing whatever to do with Christianity?

Obama must know that his carefully laundered messaging is increasingly met with mockery. Even some Democrats are rolling their eyes.
Here in the U.S., a conversation is certainly under way about whether Islam, at least as practised in its birthplace, is as intrinsically peaceful as the two most recent American presidents have claimed.

It's going to be difficult to have this conversation without offending a lot of people, or exciting those nativists who have nurtured resentment and even hatred of Muslims since 9/11.

But it's taking place. The question is whether it can proceed sensibly.


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I read the Atlantic piece mentioned above. Frightening, and more so than any christian apocalyptic nonsense peddled, that I've come across before. Nuke the fuckers.
 
Heh. Isis theme wedding. Wait for the cage.

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http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/topstories...-us-about-deradicalizing-extremists-1.2982147

go backNewsTop Stories

i
What the Nazi era can teach us about deradicalizing extremists
Programs to reintegrate radicals need to deal with theology as well as violence

5:00 AM ETAlyssa McMurtry, for CBC News
There is something powerful lurking behind the message of ISIS. More than 3,400 people from the West and thousands more from nearby regions have left their homes to live in a war zone, Associated Press reports.

ISIS glorifies violence, showing beheaded journalists with the gusto of a Nike ad, ransacks and destroys museums and commits mass slaughters, while frantically awaiting an apocalypse, according to some, such as Atlantic editor Graeme Wood, who has studied its messages carefully.

And while ISIS territorial expansion may have stalled, new groups in countries like Libya and Nigeria have pledged their allegiance to it, raising the question of how the West could combat its underlying message.

"This is no longer about territory, this is about ideas," Heather Gregg, a professor of defence analysis and religious violence at the Naval Postgraduate School in California, said in an interview.

Throughout history, humanity has dealt with contagious ideas preaching brutality and disregard for life. One response to this challenge has involved efforts to convert radicals away from their destructive ideas.

mideast-crisis-britain-jihadijohn.JPG

A masked, black-clad militant who has been identified as a Briton named Mohammed Emwazi or "Jihadi John" brandishes a knife in this still image from a 2014 video. (Reuters)


In the 1930s and 1940s, for example, Nazis and their associates systematically murdered millions, announcing that non-Aryan peoples were subhuman.

During the Second World War, when it suddenly became imperative to create new defences against a relentless attack, Western military and civilian agencies deployed a combination of modern sociology, psychology, and technology to focus on ideological change, Kristi Cooper, an Oxford University expert in Second World War counter-ideology, said in an interview.

"It was not so much about changing minds, it was about frustrating ambitions," said Cooper. "It was providing the proper structures and incentives to offer them an alternative future."

Throughout the war, the British captured Nazi prisoners, whom they studied in detail. The British evaluated their motivations and dedication, and focused their attention on those in the grey zone, who were not too adamant about their beliefs.

"This was the chief group whose attitudes could be easily influenced, and influence formation was the objective. These converts were then used to identify others and a key technique was the encouragement of their peers in the belief of an alternative future."

Denazification was concerned with removing those with strong Nazi views from positions of power and this ideological work was concerned with ensuring as much as possible that those useful to the British cause were identified and given positions of influence, said Cooper.

She said the hope for reintegration into the European community was key to Germany leaving behind Nazism and transforming itself into one of the most powerful democracies in Europe.

syrian-refugees-jordan.JPG

Syrian refugees children warm themselves after a heavy snowstorm at Al-Zaatari refugee camp in Mafraq, Jordan, near the border with Syria, on Feb. 21. (Muhammad Hamed/Reuters)


Today, several programs are in use to combat the ISIS messages.

Extreme Dialogue in Canada and the 77th Brigade in England are two programs Western countries are using to directly combat these ideas from spreading.

In Montreal a tip line is being created so people can report extremists of any kind.

Most deradicalization programs engage in theological debate and some bring in support from families, financial influence, vocational training and mental-health care.

Since there is no way to measure a person's deep beliefs, data is hard to collect and success is difficult to measure.

The messenger is important
Since ISIS draws heavily on religion for recruitment and retention, Gregg thinks religious debate is crucial. But she says the messenger is as important as the message.

She says when secular leaders like Barack Obama, president of the United States, or moderate Muslims try to engage in the religious conversation, they may be reinforcing ISIS's argument that these groups are trying to lead people astray.

The best messengers, she said, are former extremists.

However, Mark Sedgwick, professor of Arab and Islamic Studies at Aarhus University in Denmark, said in an interview that since there isn’t only one reason people join ISIS, individual cases must be treated differently.

"If you've got someone with mental health issues, you want to address those and not engage in a theological debate or a discussion of international relations.

"If you're dealing with a former colonel in Saddam's army ... he's engaging in a particular conflict and that's the point that needs to be addressed."

Unforeseen consequences
Much like military intervention, cultural and psychological interventions can have dangerous, unforeseen consequences.

After the British identified and encouraged former Nazis they hoped would promote British values, they saw a number become ardent Communists.

Ribal al-Assad, who is the cousin of Syria's President Bashar al-Assad but opposes him and campaigns for human rights, said in an interview that people in Iraq and Syria who are fighting alongside ISIS don't necessarily believe in the religious fundamentalism of the group but join because they have no other options.

Like denazification, the coalition forces invaded Iraq with the goal of eradicating the influence of Saddam Hussein's party. In doing so, they implemented "debaathification."

Any public sector employee related to Hussein’s secular Baath party was fired. This meant that some 30,000 teachers, judges, politicians and engineers found themselves jobless. On top of that, the coalition dissolved the approximately 500,000-member military.

"ISIS was set up by the Baathists, or former Baathists, because they want to scare the West and they want the West to come talk to them because they (the Baathists) can get rid of them," Ribal al-Assad said.

Maryam Namazie, a human rights activist, says the Western media should discuss and try to combat ISIS as a fascist movement instead of an Islamic one.

"It's sort of portrayed as what people want in the Middle East, North Africa or South Asia and it’s important to show how this movement actually makes inroads by limiting people's rights and by slaughtering people,” Namazie said in an interview.

"It's no longer about the belief, it's about power."

Alyssa McMurtry is a freelance journalist based in Madrid.
 
Today a plane with 150 people ( died) has been bombed by masons or their puppets the islamists

From Barcelona to Germany.

I am flying there in two weeks. same route.
 
Islam brutality in schools. Then you wonder why you get militants.

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The boy wearing the blue denim dress shirt in the middle got the worst. Chile abuse then leads to rapists and jihadists.
 
The Oslo capital of Norway is having Islamic gang fights every week. The Islamic mafia are sending their youths hit men to kill each other and control narcotics and prostitution areas in Oslo. More and more Islamic immigrants are quitting high school to join the Islamic mafia in Norway. The average dropouts in Norway are between age 15-17. 90% of the dropouts are of Islamic origin. 10% dropouts are of ethnic Norwegian origin.
Click to expand...

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Here, a new special awareness campaign to inform Muslims - well convenience store workers and can drivers - that blind people often have seeing eye dogs and despite Arab-Guys' hatred of dogs as they are unclean and they have to do their ablutions. They should not discriminate against Blind-Guy's dogs.

Of course, 7-11 is a sponsor and one of the first places the awareness campaign will happen.
 
prince nez said:
Feinstein 'Torture Report' outs C. Martel as Islamophobe

Feinstein 'Torture Report' outs C. Martel as Islamophobe

Charles_Martel_Diane_Feinstein.jpg


Diane Feinstein's recently released report on controversial CIA interrogation practices indicts, not only the Bush administration, but also all previous administrations going back to the controversial leader of the Franks, Charles Martel, and his victory over the moderate Muslim community at Tours in 732 AD, which can only be described as a gross law enforcement misconduct and hate crime.

Citing inside information from medieval Latin and Arabic sources, the report prepared by Feinstein's staffers details a shocking degree of intolerance and Islamophobia on the part of Charles Martel's administration and the army of Franks, who countered the peaceful expansion of moderate Muslims into Europe via Spain with such violent hatred that historians suspect could only be explained by racist motives.

"Clearly this was racial profiling on part of the Frankish administration," determined Yale historian Dr. Hussein al-Isis. "Franks and other white Europeans were simply uncomfortable around brown Middle Easterners, no matter how harmless their intentions."

While mostly white contemporary historians crowed about a "Christian victory over Islam," understandably bitter and disaffected members of the Muslim community, victimized by Martel's extremist policies, were compelled to fend for themselves while retreating through the Pyrenees shouting, "Hands up, don't spear me!" and "Death to Infidels!" Through no fault of their own, villages were plundered and citizens killed by some of the elements within the otherwise peaceful group of Muslim protesters, who became radicalized as a result of racism and gross civil right violations.

"I was disgusted at what we uncovered," said an indignant Senator Diane Feinstein. "Instead of empathizing with the Muslim community and hearing their side of the story - instead of trying to find common ground and a mutually acceptable compromise through interfaith dialogue and negotiations, the bigoted leader of the Franks chose to kill the Muslim leader, Abdul Rahman al-Ghafiqi."

Battle_of_Tours_CHarles_Martel.jpg


"For this sickening display of barbarism," added Feinstein, "he received the nickname of Martel, meaning 'the Hammer,' and has continued to symbolize the greatest threat to world peace and harmony until his title "the Hammer" was passed to the Republican leader Tom Delay.

"We have only ourselves to blame for this mess," opined foreign policy expert and former presidential candidate, Ron Paul. "If Martel had not unilaterally meddled in Middle Eastern affairs, then there wouldn't have been any of that blowback. The fact that Islam was spreading by violent conquest a century before the Battle of Tours is a direct result of Martel's misguided foreign adventures."

At a White House press conference, President Obama informed reporters that "I just found out about the Battle of Tours while watching History Channel, and let me tell you, nobody is angrier about this than I am. I have asked our outgoing attorney general, Eric Holder, to immediately investigate Martel's activities, to get to the bottom of this issue, and if possible, to take legal action against Charles Martel and the Frankish Kingdom. We will not rest until we have a conviction."

Nevertheless, the president did appeal for restraint. "As you protest, you're probably thinking like I'm thinking: this is the result of over a millennia of documentable Islamophobia. You know, this touches me on a personal level: Abdul Rahman al-Ghafiqi looks just like Michelle with a beard. This isn't just a Shia problem, or a Sunni problem, or a Sufi problem, it's an American problem. While I understand the rage, the calls for Jihad, the desire to impale all white Christians and burn down their churches, let's everybody stay calm and let social justice take its course."

Meanwhile, protesters holding posters of al-Ghafiqi were blocking major highways in large cities across America, and NFL players were seen charging onto the field, then collapsing and shouting, "Hands up, don't spear me!"
Click to expand...

This is just so...:mustresist:
 
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