The knitwear thread

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
I understood you completely and what are you saying you are totally right but also wrong because you cannot compare an 30 years old aspirated engine with today electric ones or even the turbo/hybrid ones , like i said in the previous post, today is a lot more complex, for god sake we have recycled cashmere now (like everything else, life was much easier in the past) just is a kind of big difference between different making...everything matters..2 ply compared to 8 ply, 5 gauge compared to 7 gauge, thicker fibre compared to thiner one, thinner threads or thicker threads ,more room in the hallow fibre also matters in the feelings, dense/lose knit everything must be taken in calculation by the customer and what he needs/wnt...in the old days was an easier way to find that great quality, because were so few true cashmere houses know-how, less complex in the making and you knew what you get.
On the "how it makes you feel" then yes ...but that makes you love more the tense knit 7 gauge compared to a more relax knit, thats why im saying (i know people who hates this but loves oversized garments, or people who never buys tense knit because of their weather)...its about what you like and what you pay for with your own money, if you like that old Ballantyne feel only you should never buy from Italians without asking how the RTW garment it is made because a lot of them dont have much specifications on their list or in their shop and every maker makes different knits with different specifications even if all are cashmere . China has no saying in the raw material for the Scottish and Italian yarns, they have to comply otherwise is a break from the rules. Colombo has fully committed to this, his family controls everything now, they harvest they spun wash dye they do everything from raising goats in Inner Mongolia till the end of the garment quality check
Again, from my perspective Apples to Apples in the quality of the knit comes from everything, from the start to the finish, how the raw material is harvest spun, washed, creates its shape. You want a specific garment, i want a great garment but because of my weather and travels i love to have different makers with different shapes constructions etc. For you, nowadays only William Lockie is coming close to the old Grade A+ Ballantyne garment, but remember that nowadays not even WL is a Grade A+ overall garment. For that you must go bespoke with the Scottish makers or for Italians you must ask them to do it for you from scratch with Scottish cashmere/yarn if they dont find for you an RTW knit
Talk with Colombo or Mr Attolini or Kiton for an 7 gauge tense knit, heavy weight 6-8 ply, raw pure or kid cashmere (they use long fibre no matter what you prefer), if you want everything attached by hand, hand stitches, natural or dyed knit, by the way you can take your Ballantyne to them and they will immediately will know what you like the most (again this is done in their warehouse not in their shops). Of course you have to pay on front but you will get you what you pay for, and if the end result is not what you like or something is a little bit different, they will do the changes or if its already more complicated they will place it in the RTW and start another one from scratch with the adjustments that you told them in the end garment. Or even WL is making at least MTM, not at level of bespoke, but you can still choose quite a lot. For example in all these years i never accounted another maker that comes close to Colombo worsted cashmere
 
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Panama

Well-Known Member
Messages
910
After the incident in which you posted pics of your Cambodian sweat shop factory jumpers, I was hoping you showed some restrain. It seems, I was wishfull thinking.
You are quite active in a Styleforum Cashmere thread, I wonder why don't you flaunt your opulence and taste over there?
I'm sorry. ¡It had to be said!
Whatever. I saw that there was an ignored post. I had put you on ignore as you had made a porn thread into a yawn thread. Next...
 

Panama

Well-Known Member
Messages
910
I store all my knitwear in plastic tubs. And certain Alan Paine jumpers come in their own zip up bags.I lost too many jumpers to moths, especially my camel jumpers.
I have bought around 60 zip lock bags as I now have more cupboard and drawer space..
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
J Johnny what is this recycled cashmere, and how prevalent is it in the cashmere market?
Its like other recycled materials, or other recycled synthetics...but while synthetics still keep their same profile because they are synthetics...naturals does not...
i encountered an recycled lambswool and cashmere that the original yarn was clearly dyed in solid dark navi and now the knit was a medium grey garment
The garments are burned because the extra steps that the recycled garments are going through
In my regards...i always advice to avoid it if the price is an premium one, instead going this route (just from budget perspective) i would recommend the mid tier on sales, or even base tier like Gobi cashmere knits in a brighter colours
 
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The Shooman

A Pretty Face
Messages
4,299
Its like other recycled materials, or other recycled synthetics...but while synthetics still keep their same profile because they are synthetics...naturals does not...
i encountered an recycled lambswool and cashmere that the original yarn was clearly was dyed in solid dark navi and now the knit was a medium grey garment
The garments are burned because the extra steps that the recycled garments are going through
In my regards...i always advice to avoid it if the price is an premium one, instead going this route (just from budget perspective) i would recommend the mid tier on sales, or even base tier like Gobi cashmere knits in a brighter colours

You say that the natural properties of the recycled wool/cashmere changes. Can you elaborate more on this. I recall once you said that it loses shape easily.

What do you mean when cashmere is recycled? I am still not understanding this.
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
You say that the natural properties of the recycled wool/cashmere changes. Can you elaborate more on this. I recall once you said that it loses shape easily.

What do you mean when cashmere is recycled? I am still not understanding this.
For short The yarn is spun dyed washed etc and in the end you get an “virgin wool/cashmere/cotton” etc.garment . sometimes makers take these virgin garments that are not sold or are arriving from customer for “recycling” and those garments are “tear apart “ reshaped, re-dyed rewashed over processed and so on , and that inevitable makes the fiber loose its original qualities because of that, it becomes a lot sensible.
From the same brand one crew neck 2 ply virgin/pure cashmere should always be more expensive than crew neck 2 ply recycled cashmere and in some countries they are forced by laws to say which one is which
 

The Shooman

A Pretty Face
Messages
4,299
For short The yarn is spun dyed washed etc and in the end you get an “virgin wool/cashmere/cotton” etc.garment . sometimes makers take these virgin garments that are not sold or are arriving from customer for “recycling” and those garments are “tear apart “ reshaped, re-dyed rewashed over processed and so on , and that inevitable makes the fiber loose its original qualities because of that, it becomes a lot sensible.
From the same brand one crew neck 2 ply virgin/pure cashmere should always be more expensive than crew neck 2 ply recycled cashmere and in some countries they are forced by laws to say which one is which

This is interesting, so they would probably be bleaching the fibers to get them lighter colour again, then reprocessing and redying. The fibers would be so broken down by this point, and none of the oils would be retailed. It really would be junk cashmere/wool wouldn't it. These type of garments would pill a lot too, and you say they stretch and lose shape??
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
This is interesting, so they would probably be bleaching the fibers to get them lighter colour again, then reprocessing and redying. The fibers would be so broken down by this point, and none of the oils would be retailed. It really would be junk cashmere/wool wouldn't it. These type of garments would pill a lot too, and you say they stretch and lose shape??
Probably yes, in general cashmere cannot be bleached without affecting the material. Virgin cashmere is never bleached. But im guessing they dye the garment on top of the old color, since, like was telling earlier, there are many brighter recycled knit that still have the old darker color like navy or black or dark grey. The positive would be that it’s cheaper, but again if you want cheap better go for mid tier cashmere on sales , or i dont know, ebay?
 
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Panama

Well-Known Member
Messages
910
Are you enjoying your alan paine ? How are they? Did you had time to try them and see how they go after some time?
The Merino wool sweaters are good. I previously hand washed them, but now have a hand wash cycle on my washing machine. I haven't worn the Geelong sweaters, as they are not soft compared to the Merino sweaters. My Alan Paine Camel is for special occasions...
 

Panama

Well-Known Member
Messages
910
Probably yes, in general cashmere cannot be bleached without affecting the material. Virgin cashmere is never bleached. But im guessing they dye the garment on top of the old color, since, like was telling earlier, there are many brighter recycled knit that still have the old darker color like navy or black or dark grey. The positive would be that it’s cheaper, but again if you want cheap better go for mid tier cashmere on sales , or i dont know, ebay?
Mid tier Cashmere would be considered as Malo or Gran Sasso? Are Falconeri and Luca Faloni entry level?

Gobi Cashmere currently has a two for one offer. Do you also consider this entry level?
 

belinmad

Damn Tacky Big Collar Daddy
Supporter
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1668441883203.jpeg


Today in transit at the airport I lost one of these lovely leather buttons from my PRL cardi.
Any ideas on where to buy a replacement?
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
Mid tier Cashmere would be considered as Malo or Gran Sasso? Are Falconeri and Luca Faloni entry level?

Gobi Cashmere currently has a two for one offer. Do you also consider this entry level?
i would rank Malo, Fedeli, LP top tier level/Grade A , mid tier im referring to Johnstons of Elgin, John Laing, Hawico, Luca Faloni is not entry level but mid, in my perspective Gobi is an entry level if you want to buy pure cashmere, under Grade B i would suggest nobody should buy cashmere, is not worth it even if its $50 retial price. Gobi is a bargain at that offer, but i would suggest to go for the brighter colours, mid grey, beige, white cashmere even i never encounter pure white cashmere on Gobi until now
 

The Shooman

A Pretty Face
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4,299
John Laing, only mid level?? I haven't worn modern John Laing, but l am really surprised it is only at the JOE level.
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
John Laing, only mid level?? I haven't worn modern John Laing, but l am really surprised it is only at the JOE level.
Yes, to keep the prices down as much while the others with this inflation raised everything but kept their quality and their artisans. But still is a great one but not on the level of consistency of Malo or LP
 

tacky

New Member
Messages
2
Do you know of anyone besides Colhays, NMWA and O'Connell selling Scott & Charters lambswool shawl-collar cardigans?
 

Johnny

Well-Known Member
Messages
87
Quick notes, who needs or see something from WL in their sizes, buy now since they will raise their prices soon
The word from them is "keep the same quality" but raise the prices, others lower the quality of raw material but keep around the same prices
I had some WL future collection (probably for 2023 F/W) and they test the new technique from Colombo already , reinforcing not just the armpit but also the ribbed hem reinforced portion within the thread itself
WL denied any talking about also going for worsted cashmere 4.0 making. So, while a lot of us here thought that WL in this era of synthetics will fall apart it seems they still want to invest in new technics and material
 
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Swiss

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Messages
101
Most recent significant knitwear acquisition
 

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The Shooman

A Pretty Face
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4,299
Most recent significant knitwear acquisition
where did you find that? I am not your size, so there is no competition. If you see one in my size can you please let me know. 23 - 24 pit to pit. Can you message me.
 
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Elote

Active Member
Messages
30
Swiss, really nice find!
That one, I believe it to be the "Royce", knitted by a member of this forum, David Cox in 1988.
We'd try David to knit some more shawl collars, to no luck so far.
Wear it in good health!
 

Swiss

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Messages
101
This cardigan is in a lovely colour!!

Here is best photo of the back I have at hand now
 

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Yes that’s a Ballantyne Royce Jacket, I remember the person that linked them with the 1/1 rib about 8 crs above the full cardigan stitch for some reason instead of the 1st crs above the fcs!
 

The Shooman

A Pretty Face
Messages
4,299
Most recent significant knitwear acquisition

That looks to be an 80's Ballantyne because it is not the heritage edition that was made in 2008. Some of the 2008's have the old 70's label with heritage edition on it while others have the 2000's label on it. Is that right David?
 

Swiss

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Messages
101
Here is a better photo of the collar and one of the care label
 

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Swiss

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Messages
101
Master knitter, thank you so much for your invaluable insights

Do you have a rough idea of how many shawl collar cardigans ballantyne used to sell every year? And what was the retail price? And which countries were the main export markets?
(Sorry lots of questions)
 
Messages
20
Last time Harrods had them they retailed at £1300 but Royce latterly were made for others like Cash & Co. Royce was identical to McGeorge Westway and when McGeorge closed Pringle took over style and orders via the Hawick mill.

One year I made 1200 Westway 5n or 12007 2.5n for Pringle then 600 following year but previously usually about 300 for McGeorge as they also knitted in house at Dumfries.

Caerlee would alter specifications for different customers as the trends changed.

Here’s the last batch Feb 2001 I knitted on the 5n Dubied MRH for Caerlee.

1670074324898.png
 

Elote

Active Member
Messages
30
Ballantyne's Shawl Collar Cardigan

Ballantyne × Harrods 12 ply


Looks as NOS as it could be!
From the 90's or maybe the last batch from 2001, as the 2008 batch -as previously mentioned -had the 1980's label with the "Heritage Edition" within it.
Master Knitter, is it one from your attelier?

Ps. Looks like I'm set to adopt the antichrist! 😃
 

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