Adventures in Bespoke Tailoring

Buitenlander

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Does anyone have a tailor they love in N Italy they would like to share? Or Naples, I just have never been there. I love my old man but things are getting too hard since I don’t live in the same town. Got back a cashmere overcoat with no breast pocket, a sport coat with a center vent (that’s not the end of the world, I guess. I am American. I’ve just never had a center vent) and worst of all a houndstooth suit with belt loops! His clothes are fully hand sewn bespoke and very good prices but now I have to go back just to have him put in a pocket. The other things are not fixable I imagine. I took the coat to my local Alterations tailor. He said he could put in a pocket but I can’t find the tissue without ordering a meter. More than a plane ticket to Italy. It was fun finding him but it took a long time.
 

doghouse

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Does anyone have a tailor they love in N Italy they would like to share? Or Naples, I just have never been there. I love my old man but things are getting too hard since I don’t live in the same town. Got back a cashmere overcoat with no breast pocket, a sport coat with a center vent (that’s not the end of the world, I guess. I am American. I’ve just never had a center vent) and worst of all a houndstooth suit with belt loops! His clothes are fully hand sewn bespoke and very good prices but now I have to go back just to have him put in a pocket. The other things are not fixable I imagine. I took the coat to my local Alterations tailor. He said he could put in a pocket but I can’t find the tissue without ordering a meter. More than a plane ticket to Italy. It was fun finding him but it took a long time.
I hope you find one. I am in Milan quite a bit and have been toying with Caraneni. Will report if I get something obviously.
 

Buitenlander

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Buitenlander

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I hope you find one. I am in Milan quite a bit and have been toying with Caraneni. Will report if I get something obviously.
Would love to see it if you do. I think he is out of my price range though. €4000 or so for a suit? Just guessing. I have been very spoiled by my man in Padova. 17 top for a suit. 35 for a cashmere overcoat. I am prepared to have to spend more than that but can’t go double.
 

Buitenlander

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... this is an argument, seriously. good lord

belt loops can be removed easily, done

what's next?
Ha! Thanks for talking me down off the ledge! The last three things I got from him each had either something missing or details I didn’t ask for or want. There have always been things like that with him but the last year has gotten worse. He is very old so I always just let it go. Thought it was funny.
My local alterations tailor said removing the belt loops would definitely leave marks. Being houndstooth and covered by a jacket might not be that noticeable? I wouldn’t wear the pants separate anyway. In USA it’s for chefs and catholic school boys. Also the fabric is old. It’s an old Harrison’s fabric so I can’t get extra to make side adjusters. Could put in buttons for braces but the rise is Italian and doesn’t seem like it could take them. I could be inventing that problem.
The breast pocket on the overcoat I am not sure what to do with. Just bring it back to him and hope he can do over a bank holiday weekend.
 

doghouse

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Would love to see it if you do. I think he is out of my price range though. €4000 or so for a suit? Just guessing. I have been very spoiled by my man in Padova. 17 top for a suit. 35 for a cashmere overcoat. I am prepared to have to spend more than that but can’t go double.
Yeah, in that range. Totally understand the financial considerations too. I have no plans to leave Poole, I love what they do for me, just kind of an itch I want to scratch with Caraceni.
 

walker

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Ha! Thanks for talking me down off the ledge!
you're welcome, but no, I don't ..., nvm.

The last three things I got from him each had either 1. something missing or details I didn’t ask for or want. There have always been things like that with him but the last year has gotten worse. He is very old so I always just let it go. Thought it was funny.
My local alterations tailor said removing the belt loops would definitely leave marks. Being 2. houndstooth and covered by a jacket might not be that noticeable? I wouldn’t wear the pants separate anyway. In USA it’s for chefs and catholic school boys. Also the fabric is old. It’s an old Harrison’s fabric so I can’t get extra to make side adjusters. Could put in buttons for braces but the rise is Italian and doesn’t seem like it could take them. I could be inventing that problem.
The breast pocket on the overcoat I am not sure what to do with. 3. Just bring it back to him and hope he can do over a bank holiday weekend.
1. this one is a pretty clear sign, that he doesn't want to work for you anymore. never ever, this is done.

2. houndstooth trousers are the trademark work clothes in international haute cuisine and all kind of food establishements. I had them, when training to become a chef. I'm familiar with this shit. USA is not the navel of the earth, not at all. limbo.

3. no, he won't. see above ..., this is too funny.
 

Buitenlander

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you're welcome, but no, I don't ..., nvm.



1. this one is a pretty clear sign, that he doesn't want to work for you anymore. never ever, this is done.

2. houndstooth trousers are the trademark work clothes in international haute cuisine and all kind of food establishements. I had them, when training to become a chef. I'm familiar with this shit. USA is not the navel of the earth, not at all. limbo.

3. no, he won't. see above ..., this is too funny.
Just from our conversation, I’m not above missing points or social cues. Maybe he doesn’t want to work for me but that would be a very passive way to tell me. The Italians I know speak their mind. When I see him he acts very excited. Introduces me to the people there as his client who comes all the way from America, takes me to lunch after fittings, his wife makes me hankies I don’t ask for. I do need the pocket done. He has always taken care of what my local tailor couldn’t fix, even a year later, happily. I will leave him alone after the coat is fixed, if I can’t find a local option.
No matter how much I love (and hate) it, I don’t think America is the cradle of civilization, it’s just my point of reference.
 

Buitenlander

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Got it! Have you not tried anything in The Netherlands? Although fully bespoke is seriously bereft.
I have never tried bespoke here. I have tried fully canvassed MTM. The quality for price was fine. When I first got here I met a couple older guys who measured. The fit was good. It seems soon after they fired everyone over 40 and I ordered a few things. Everything got tighter and some didn’t have enough fabric to even let out. In parts. I kind of gave up. Have you used any of them?
 

Lobbster

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Have you considered Vienna? Bernhard Roetzel has written an extensive piece about the options there and some were quite young. He only left out Johanna Kastner. I suppose you won't have any of the aforementiones problems ordering from any of them.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I have never tried bespoke here. I have tried fully canvassed MTM. The quality for price was fine. When I first got here I met a couple older guys who measured. The fit was good. It seems soon after they fired everyone over 40 and I ordered a few things. Everything got tighter and some didn’t have enough fabric to even let out. In parts. I kind of gave up. Have you used any of them?
There are a number of options for fully bespoke, but I'm pretty much a straight-up and down fit so I'm satisfied with MTM or off-the-rack with some tweaks as most blocks will work for me. The Hague is pretty well served, in no order of quality or distinction: F.G. Van den Heuvel, Vanita, Ettemadis, Diya, Savile Row & Co. All of them will do fully bespoke. The old owners of F.G. van den Heuvel have retired but still good. Savile Row and Vanita I've used as well and are good. Lots of other MTM options in addition to these.
 

walker

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No matter how much I love (and hate) it, I don’t think America is the cradle of civilization, it’s just my point of reference.
a very unnecessary, imo.

well, sure, you know him better, but it sounds familiar to me, nvm. as someone said, try vienna. of course, we austrians have our quirks also. good luck.
 

Scherensammler

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as someone said, try vienna
Not sure, but are they (style wise) not closer to the Germans than the Italians?
So they might not be able to give him the look and feel he's looking for...

Edit (since the websites have changed or are not really that telling):

Prices are in SR range and the overall look is more Germanic.
 
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Pimpernel Smith

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Not sure, but are they (style wise) not closer to the Germans than the Italians?
What I notice about German style, along it still being acceptable to sport a moustache, is that they're very comfortable with the sports jackets with lots of New Zealand wool checks for business wear. They're a bit less suit orientated at the higher levels, then say here in The Netherlands.
 

walker

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Not sure, but are they (style wise) not closer to the Germans than the Italians?
Closer to whom? I never heard that viennese tailors took input from sauerkraut, wtf. Pls elaborate ..., heiss und fettig und nicht die scheisse wie sonst, sonst gehen hier bald die lichter aus, kennst di aus?

So they might not be able to give him the look and feel he's looking for...
Since when have obese people a choice ever? Just tell me. I'm really interested ...

Prices are in SR range and the overall look is more Germanic.
Fuck the prices if 1 - 2k don't make a difference. Wtf is germanic in regards of bespoke tailoring? Sorry, I'm not familiar with this term, but I'm always open to open my horizon. Come to me baby, big hug.

PS: Choose your words wisely, no theoretical bullshit. Kurz & bündig, faktenbezogen und aus der Praxis.
 

Scherensammler

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Fuck the prices if 1 - 2k don't make a difference. Wtf is germanic in regards of bespoke tailoring? Sorry, I'm not familiar with this term, but I'm always open to open my horizon. Come to me baby, big hug.

PS: Choose your words wisely, no theoretical bullshit. Kurz & bündig, faktenbezogen und aus der Praxis.
There is no quick answer to this.
"Germanic style" (to give it a name) is overall a bit more generous in size (not close fitting), wider, straight shoulders and deeper armholes compared to British and Italian tailors. Usually solidly made but overall a bit bland, especially in the period after the 80's up until now.
German men appear to prefer a wider, more "comfortable" cut. Da darf nichts spannen oder zwicken!
In my old (50's to 70's) tailoring magazines the Viennese tailors were described as a bit more daring and flamboyant regarding the cut and details, but from what I remember the basic silhouette was the same.
Keep in mind that the tailoring schools in the Northern parts of continental Europe were very similar.
Müller & Sohn was probably one of the biggest schools and travelled as far as Scandinavia for giving special courses to the local tailors.
They had a big influence in the areas with Germanic languages (incl. Austria, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Scandinavia), perhaps even in the Eastern European countries.
 

walker

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Excellent my dear.

Of course, your technical and probably your theoretical knowledge is far above mine.

Vienna has been a melting pot of influences. Has it been clothes, has it been shoes, e.g. the tuczek toe derives from here, nvm.

ffwd: my ladyfriend Patricia Markus is the head of the guild of crafts for tailoring in Vienna, acutally her atelier is more into female pret-a-porter, but she trained at Netousek(mentioned in Roetzel's essay). While I'm not located in Vienna anymore - guided tours on one's one behalf can be arranged and if it is only for avoiding lost in translation issues.

There is no quick answer to this.
"Germanic style" (to give it a name) is overall a bit more generous in size (not close fitting), wider, straight shoulders and deeper armholes compared to British and Italian tailors. Usually solidly made but overall a bit bland, especially in the period after the 80's up until now.
German men appear to prefer a wider, more "comfortable" cut. Da darf nichts spannen oder zwicken!
In my old (50's to 70's) tailoring magazines the Viennese tailors were described as a bit more daring and flamboyant regarding the cut and details, but from what I remember the basic silhouette was the same.
Keep in mind that the tailoring schools in the Northern parts of continental Europe were very similar.
Müller & Sohn was probably one of the biggest schools and travelled as far as Scandinavia for giving special courses to the local tailors.
They had a big influence in the areas with Germanic languages (incl. Austria, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Scandinavia), perhaps even in the Eastern European countries.
 

Scherensammler

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Better stay away from this German one:

While it's a good example of the latest "Germanic" look post 1990's, the execution and with that the final result are horrible.
My task next week is to make a fitting for a foreign customer from start to finish. Full on SR style.
If I remember I'll take pictures and make a seperate thread on this forum.
 
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