Trouble in Palestine and Israel

Rambo

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Where are you getting your facts from? Nickelodeon?
Yes……those people at Nickelodeon…





Even the fucking wiki on hamas has this info in it.

at least put in a minor amount of effort and cursory research next time. Or maybe switch to watching the Cartoon Network?
 

Rambo

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You seem to be missing the point here
oh no i got it. you're really missing your calling. you should be working for the state as one of their official propagandists.

Hamas is launching 1000's of missiles against Israel indiscriminately against civilians and Israeli defence forces are taking appropriate action in neutralising the threat.
you can't possibly be dumb enough to believe this, still, to this day.

also, how do you see knocking down residential buildings that house news agencies as threat neutralizing?

If your home town was subject to that type of barrage, I wager you would be a little bit agitated and looking for the threat to be neutralized?
well they just can't seem to get the job done can they? you'd think after 40 years of this shit something would have given by now.
 

güero

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lack of reading comprehension really hurting the forum today. 'fear of'.

i'm sure, of course, that you're familiar with zionism and what it stands for?
I am sorry, that’s because I’m stupid!

I am not overly familiar with Zionism and I also don’t care too much.
 

Journeyman

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I remember talking about it with a Jewish lady friend of mine and her attitude was resolute. No accommodation for Arabs. They can't control their sexual impulses so they grow rampant like weeds so please don't let them acquire more property or do anything that would support housing more of them.

Perhaps she should look to the ultra-Orthodox Jewish (Haredim) community in Israel - more than 4% growth year-on-year due to marrying young and having large families. Typically, Haredim spend time in religious study and so don't serve in the Israeli Defence Force (IDF), either.

All the well worn anti-Semitic tropes are already out in force, you know when some Leftard starts wittering on about Zionism within 2 minutes they'll be frothing at the mouth about Israeli ethnic cleansing, they never learnt anything from Holocaust as they practice genocide themselves, did you know there was no Jewish people killed in the twin towers on 9/11 as they all stayed home, etc, etc.

I know that we've discussed this before, but you may have forgotten - simply because someone is critical of Israel, does not make them anti-Semitic.

It would be like someone calling you anti-British, because you are sometimes critical of the UK government or members of the royal family.

Criticising the actions of a country's government does not automatically equate to hating, or discriminating against, that country's people.
 

Halberstram

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The first genocide in history where the population is steadily increasing
View attachment 38098
A genocide is not necessarily dependent on the succesfull murdering of more humans than are newly born within the same population. A genocide does not even require successful killings. Please see the correct definition of the UN:

Definition​

Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide

Article II
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
  1. Killing members of the group;
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
 

Sauce

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Hamas is just another group set up to achive short term goals as allies that has turned on its backers. The world is full of them. In many cases the USA and European countries knew they would become long term problems in the furture. Its something the "free west" keeps repeating to support Imperialist goals.
 

güero

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A genocide is not necessarily dependent on the succesfull murdering of more humans than are newly born within the same population. A genocide does not even require successful killings. Please see the correct definition of the UN:

Definition​

Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide

Article II
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
  1. Killing members of the group;
  2. Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
  3. Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
  4. Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
  5. Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
That’s rubbish, that is precisely what “acts committed with intent to destroy” means.
 

florisgreen

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Hamas is just another group set up to achive short term goals as allies that has turned on its backers. The world is full of them. In many cases the USA and European countries knew they would become long term problems in the furture. Its something the "free west" keeps repeating to support Imperialist goals.
Yes, you can't export your values and the democracy all over the world, some countries won't accept it, even though in our "western" eyes it may look inexplicable. So the intervention in Iraq has been a total failure and has by no extent improved the old status quo. And the same could be in Afganistan.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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I know that we've discussed this before, but you may have forgotten - simply because someone is critical of Israel, does not make them anti-Semitic.

It would be like someone calling you anti-British, because you are sometimes critical of the UK government or members of the royal family.

Criticising the actions of a country's government does not automatically equate to hating, or discriminating against, that country's people.
When you join a demonstration in support of Hamas, a group who's aim is to eliminate Jews, with grotesque anti-Semitic blow-up caricatures next to you as with Corbyn when he was giving his speech at the weekend, then you're a racist, anti-Semitic bigot.

When you expect Israel to not defend itself, make false equivalences to the Holocaust, genocide and that Jews are uniquely bad and you blast out with loud speakers in a slow driving convoy through parts of London with large Jewish populations that you're going fuck their mothers and daughters then it isn't criticism.

Why was the Left not marching for the Kurds who had a village flattened by Turkey a week so ago?

Why not march against The Kingdom, who are busy bombing indiscriminately in Yemen?

But we all know the truth, when it comes to racism, anti-Semitism is the only acceptable game in town.

Edit: apologies, the actual message delivered to north London was ''Fuck the Jews, rape their mothers and daughters.'' Charming.
 
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Rambo

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When you join a demonstration in support of Hamas, a group who's aim is to eliminate Jews, with grotesque anti-Semitic blow-up caricatures next to you as with Corbyn when he was giving his speech at the weekend, then you're a racist, anti-Semitic bigot.
so support of any palestinian person = anti-semitism? good to know where we stand on this.

When you expect Israel to not defend itself,
why doesn't palestine get to defend itself? this ridiculous framing is getting old.

make false equivalences to the Holocaust
actual equivalences

genocide and that Jews are uniquely bad
no, israel is bad. zionism is bad. jews are just people that believe in a religion.

you blast out with loud speakers in a slow driving convoy through parts of London with large Jewish populations that you're going fuck their mothers and daughters then it isn't criticism.
is this a fever dream you're having?

Why was the Left not marching for the Kurds who had a village flattened by Turkey a week so ago?
Dropbear Dropbear

Why not march against The Kingdom, who are busy bombing indiscriminately in Yemen?
people are!
But we all know the truth, when it comes to racism, anti-Semitism is the only acceptable game in town.
who knows this? no one knows about this. its just something you've made up in your head.

Edit: apologies, the actual message delivered to north London was ''Fuck the Jews, rape their mothers and daughters.'' Charming.
ok well glad we got that straight.
 

Fwiffo

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"'The American people, stop giving, stop giving weapons to the occupiers,' she told NBC News amid the rubble in the tiny, impoverished Gaza Strip. 'That’s the way that you can help us.'"
 

Rambo

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"'The American people, stop giving, stop giving weapons to the occupiers,' she told NBC News amid the rubble in the tiny, impoverished Gaza Strip. 'That’s the way that you can help us.'"
No pithy comment?
 

florisgreen

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"'The American people, stop giving, stop giving weapons to the occupiers,' she told NBC News amid the rubble in the tiny, impoverished Gaza Strip. 'That’s the way that you can help us.'"
Well, what can you expect from a poor child who sees bombs raining over their heads and destroying their houses. Certainly not that she can analyze and understand the reasons for that, also because probably nobody told her that it's Hamas that began the war and is still launching lots of rockets over Israel.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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so support of any palestinian person = anti-semitism? good to know where we stand on this.


why doesn't palestine get to defend itself? this ridiculous framing is getting old.


actual equivalences


no, israel is bad. zionism is bad. jews are just people that believe in a religion.


is this a fever dream you're having?


Dropbear Dropbear


people are!

who knows this? no one knows about this. its just something you've made up in your head.


ok well glad we got that straight.
Hamas in Gaza was not defending itself, it was waging war with indiscriminate rocket attacks.

In the name of Palestine:

 

Rambo

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Hamas in Gaza was not defending itself, it was waging war with indiscriminate rocket attacks.
i sure hope it was more discriminate otherwise you're defeating your own point here.

In the name of Palestine:
right do you want to run the count on the acts of violence in the media? i'll put a $100 donation to the forum on the fact that I'll win.
 

Pimpernel Smith

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i sure hope it was more discriminate otherwise you're defeating your own point here.


right do you want to run the count on the acts of violence in the media? i'll put a $100 donation to the forum on the fact that I'll win.
Hamas is a terrorist organisation, but let's not get lost in semantics, after all one man's suicide bomber is another's martyr.

Hamas is explicit in what it thinks about the Jews and the Left is in it's alliance with Islamists too.

It's quite clear what Israel must do to defend itself: take out Hamas as an effective military and terrorist organisation. And that's exactly what they are doing and anyone in their position would do exactly the same.
 

Kingstonian

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Rambo

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Hamas is a terrorist organisation, but let's not get lost in semantics, after all one man's suicide bomber is another's martyr.
One man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter. Something you should try to keep in perspective. The Israeli government condemned Nelson Mandela because he wouldn’t foreclose on violence as a solution to apartheid.
It's quite clear what Israel must do to defend itself: take out Hamas as an effective military and terrorist organisation. And that's exactly what they are doing and anyone in their position would do exactly the same.
Won’t something just pop up in its place? Do you think if you kill every single Hamas member the entirety of the Palestinian population will just roll over and succumb to being slaughtered and having their ancestral home stolen away from them?
 

Rambo

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Opening paragraph:
Sheikh Jarrah today smells of dirty socks and rotting flesh. Israeli police vehicles, known as “skunk trucks”, have been spraying Palestinian homes, shops, restaurants, public spaces and cultural institutions with putrid water at high pressure. The water causes vomiting, stomach pain and skin irritation, and was originally developed by an Israeli company to repel protesters. The stench lasts for days on clothes, skin and homes, leading Palestinians to joke that Jerusalem all smells like shit. Protesters are also targeted in other ways. They are brutally beaten, arrested by the police, some on mounted horses, attacked by settlers and sprayed with rubber bullets.
 

Rambo

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759f8e35baea07e9bc82c5cdfd67081e100522f5.jpg
 

Pimpernel Smith

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It's all a Zionist conspiracy, including the creation of Hamas which according to the above cartoon doesn't even exist:

 

Pimpernel Smith

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Western libtards and leftists...why do you hate Israel above all nations? Your irrational bigotry is exposed here:

 

florisgreen

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Western libtards and leftists...why do you hate Israel above all nations? Your irrational bigotry is exposed here:

Yes, since ever the left took the part of the Palestinians, never distancing from terrorism and giving all the faults to Israel. Here in Germany it's supposed the right to be anti-Israel and anti-semite, but in fact it's the left so much more.
 

Rambo

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Protecting Diaspora Jews And Ending The Israeli Threat To Jews​

2021 May 20
by Ian Welsh
Last week I argued you couldn’t be Jewish (in any religious sense) and defend Israel’s actions.
The great Rabbi Hillell, challenged to teach the Torah while standing on leg, said:
“What is hateful to you, do not do to your fellow: this is the whole Torah; the rest is the explanation; go and learn.”
It should then be obvious that stealing people’s houses, beating them, destroying their orchards and killing them is in complete opposition to the whole Torah.
Now everyone who isn’t a bald faced liar or a fool knows that Israel uses its “Jewish” status as a shield. If you criticize Israeli crimes against humanity or war crimes, you are called an anti-semite. Lives are destroyed, routinely, by accusations of anti-semitism.
Meanwhile we have actual anti-semitism caused by the reaction to Israel’s crimes. People get mad, and a very few attack Jews.
“Somebody in one of the cars driving by started throwing glass bottles or glass cups at the tables and they shattered everywhere,” she said. A bunch of the cars stopped and maybe 30 of the men in the cars got out, started running towards the tables and asking indiscriminately, ‘Who’s Jewish.’”
No one was seriously hurt. Los Angeles police said they are investigating this as a hate crime, with five victims who were either punched or injured by broken glass.
Obviously this is horrible, though nothing near as bad as what is happening to Palestinians as I write. But it could be a precursor of far worse actions.
Anti-semitism is terrible. It shouldn’t be tolerated.
And Israel creates it on a vast scale by claiming to be a Jewish state, the committing atrocities, then using that they are Jewish as a shield from criticism or change.
In effect Israel claims that its crimes are Jewish crimes. To criticize them is to criticize Jews.
This is bullshit. Israel is a settler apartheid state, but it’s not Jewish except somewhat ethnically, because what it does routinely; what it did to create itself (cleanse Palestinians at its birth, and steal their homes) is against the whole Torah.
Israel isn’t Jewish. They’re an evil state who has stolen the cloak of a great religion, which under Rabbinical guidance has largely been peaceful, and used abhorrence of the Holocaust and anti-semitism to allow them to steal and murder.
Stealing and murdering aren’t Jewish, they are what Judaism stands against.
The way forward is simple: Jews and non-Jews need to push back, at every chance, when Israel claims to be Jewish. It isn’t
When it is seen that it isn’t, this will both make Jews outside of Israel (and within Israel who oppose Israel’s crimes) safer, and make a one-state settlement which makes everyone in Israel-Palestine a citizen and equal before the law more likely.
If Israel isn’t Jewish, then it’s no big deal to have Palestinians be citizens.
Israel as a state that claims to be Jewish, and uses its supposed Judaism as a shield against criticism of its crimes, needs to end.
What will remain is a state that by treating everyone equally (do not do to your fellow what is hateful to you) will be more Jewish for proclaiming it less.
May God, in all his forms, bless those who seek equality and peace and cast his gaze upon Israel, who claim to be his children, and bring to them Justice with Mercy.
 

Rambo

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Parts of the Left has always had an interest in internationalist anti-Semitism.
boy you sure did hit the nail on the head there by once again equating the freedom of the palestinian people with anti-semitism.
 
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